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danieldiggle
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Quote danieldiggle Replybullet Topic: Red Bearon
    Posted: 30 October 2017 at 3:03am
Starting to work up the first boss for Skies Of Chaos, the Red Bearon.

It's a large mega-ship with multiple cannons/launchers etc.
Just trying to figure out the material/texture at moment - wether it should be wood/canvas or a metal ship with rivits etc.



In-situ it'll look a little like this (no weapons added yet):


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eishiya
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Quote eishiya Replybullet Posted: 30 October 2017 at 8:29am
Will damage be shown on it as the battle progresses? Both metal and wood have some interesting ways of being damaged, perhaps you could choose based on which you like best. With wood, you could end up with a sort of skeletal look with rips in the canvas. With metal, you can have rivets flying off in all directions and chunks of wing falling off/out.

Also, if the player is flying up, shouldn't the boss be flying down, facing the player? Or is the player attacking it from behind?

The lighting in the environment seems to be firmly from the left, but the lighting on the plane is inconsistent with this, and it's casting a shadow directly below itself.
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NancyGold
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Quote NancyGold Replybullet Posted: 30 October 2017 at 9:35am
That thing is too huge and looks barren. It won't be able to move a lot and player will have little space to maneuver. I would suggest making it much smaller and adding some details, like say a cannon, that player can destroy.
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Quote NancyGold Replybullet Posted: 30 October 2017 at 9:39am
Originally posted by eishiya


Also, if the player is flying up, shouldn't the boss be flying down, facing the player? Or is the player attacking it from behind?

I guess it is intended to look as if player is chasing it (i.e. that huge plane carries Hitler/Putin/Stalin, take it down). It would look ridiculous,  had it been facing towards the player, , because airplanes cannot fly backwards.
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danieldiggle
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Quote danieldiggle Replybullet Posted: 30 October 2017 at 10:08am
Originally posted by eishiya

Will damage be shown on it as the battle progresses? Both metal and wood have some interesting ways of being damaged, perhaps you could choose based on which you like best. With wood, you could end up with a sort of skeletal look with rips in the canvas. With metal, you can have rivets flying off in all directions and chunks of wing falling off/out.Also, if the player is flying up, shouldn't the boss be flying down, facing the player? Or is the player attacking it from behind?The lighting in the environment seems to be firmly from the left, but the lighting on the plane is inconsistent with this, and it's casting a shadow directly below itself.


It's a scrolling shooter so player is chasing the plane (as if they've matched forward speeds).
Yep, there will be several damage states as you progress through the battle!

You're right, I need to go through and check my lighting throughout - a lot of assets I've done so far have been iterations of early bits and I haven't set the lighting positions yet. Best I do that now before it gets more confused!
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danieldiggle
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Quote danieldiggle Replybullet Posted: 30 October 2017 at 10:11am
Originally posted by snv

That thing is too huge and looks barren. It won't be able to move a lot and player will have little space to maneuver. I would suggest making it much smaller and adding some details, like say a cannon, that player can destroy.


The boss doesn't need to move much - if at all - It's more you moving around the boss to attack the different turrets and weakpoints to take it down - also this version is for a mobile game, so the boss is not all in view - you fly left and right to see the full expanse of it. :-)

This is just the base/blocking - so lots of detail to add yet - it is indeed a bit barren at moment!
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Quote Omegan's Domain Replybullet Posted: 30 October 2017 at 11:28am
Few topics for one project? Like for me is spamming.

I like this concept of huge mega-ship but its size can be used as last boss, at the beginning may be you gonna add something in half size of this.
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danieldiggle
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Quote danieldiggle Replybullet Posted: 02 November 2017 at 9:22am
Starting to get a metal panel / rivits details into the boss. Still haven't decided on turret placement or design. And I need to add engine exhausts or some type of exposed metal around the engine housing, to suggest its a weak point to be targeted.

The area around the tail is probably the most complete so far. I'm a little worried that the metal paneling looks a little 'circuit board'y' ?

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Hapiel
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Quote Hapiel Replybullet Posted: 02 November 2017 at 1:34pm
I don't think its too bad, but definitely going in tat direction. It is hard to find cool details to add on such metal sheets, It makes much more sense for everything to be smooth. Perhaps ad some more design elements instead (such as the lines and skulls), and have more contrast on the wing flaps?

Or try to divide it in panels in a more systematic way? Perhaps you can take some inspiration from these  (but don't copy the awful shading ;) )
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danieldiggle
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Quote danieldiggle Replybullet Posted: 02 November 2017 at 4:28pm
Not sure if your reply was supposed to have images in it? they haven't shown if so! :-)

Here's some further progress in-situ. I've got more panel detailing, but need to make the flaps a little more contrasty like you say.

Still need to add in all the turrets/defences too, but coming together nicely so far I think.

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Quote Hapiel Replybullet Posted: 02 November 2017 at 5:42pm
It was supposed to have this link in the text... oops!
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Quote NancyGold Replybullet Posted: 03 November 2017 at 6:59am
Originally posted by Hapiel

It was supposed to have this link in the text... oops!

Why do their flat planes have such curved shading?
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danieldiggle
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Quote danieldiggle Replybullet Posted: 06 November 2017 at 5:59am
Very nearly finished... Will share full image for crit (minus effects ;-) ) soon.

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Quote NancyGold Replybullet Posted: 06 November 2017 at 6:36am
That cockpit looks flat and amateurish, especially glass with all that dithering, which suggests rougher texture. The cockpit frame has strange light direction, implying it is highlighted from the bottom. Consider doing something Contra style:
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danieldiggle
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Quote danieldiggle Replybullet Posted: 06 November 2017 at 11:38am
Originally posted by snv


That cockpit looks flat and amateurish, especially glass with all that dithering, which suggests rougher texture. The cockpit frame has strange light direction, implying it is highlighted from the bottom. Consider doing something Contra style:


Your right, the cockpit is a bit naff at the moment. I've tried a few things but didn't know how to do glass well yet. But the general style of cockpit is about right. I'll have a crack at the lighting suggested!
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Quote Hapiel Replybullet Posted: 06 November 2017 at 3:31pm
I too find the cockpit design confusing, besides the funny shading.

Why does this plane have a glass nose? Why not place the cockpit a bit further behind the nose, like every airplane in existence? And also, typically on these double wing planes the cockpit is connected to the bottom wing. Does it really need to come through the top one? How does it look from the side? And would the edges in the wing have such strong corners, instead of a more rounded aerodynamic shapes going towards a sharp point in the back?

Looking at it more, I'm also not sure how the engines are. Are they embedded in the flat wings? Are they underneath it? By googling "propeller on wings" I found some interesting images, usually they are placed much further in the front of the wings and have a very specific box shape.

Of course your plane doesn't need to be realistic, but by understanding the properties of real planes you might be able to make a design that feels more logical
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danieldiggle
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Quote danieldiggle Replybullet Posted: 06 November 2017 at 5:03pm
Originally posted by Hapiel

I too find the cockpit design confusing, besides the funny shading.

Why does this plane have a glass nose? Why not place the cockpit a bit further behind the nose, like every airplane in existence? And also, typically on these double wing planes the cockpit is connected to the bottom wing. Does it really need to come through the top one? How does it look from the side? And would the edges in the wing have such strong corners, instead of a more rounded aerodynamic shapes going towards a sharp point in the back?

Looking at it more, I'm also not sure how the engines are. Are they embedded in the flat wings? Are they underneath it? By googling "propeller on wings" I found some interesting images, usually they are placed much further in the front of the wings and have a very specific box shape.

Of course your plane doesn't need to be realistic, but by understanding the properties of real planes you might be able to make a design that feels more logical


The game is a mixture of real and steampunk style so isn't intended on following reality too much. As for glass cockpit/nose - check out 'Lancaster Bomber' in google - a WW2 bomber with glass nose and gun. This is a crazy mash up between a biplane and a bomber :-)

I might move engines forward again. Brought them back because the overall size of the boss needs to play area.

Tbh, I didn't really plan the design, just iterating as I go. The next ones should be a little more structurally logical!
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Hapiel
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Quote Hapiel Replybullet Posted: 07 November 2017 at 2:55pm
Nice to see that you have a reference, those pictures are worth  more than any critique we'll ever give you! And that Lancaster Bomber sure has an interesting design!

Based on that kind of nose, I would suggest this, because your current one still makes me think more of a zeppelin than of a mean machine:



I understand that you might not have so much space.. but don't be limited to the frame, the plane can move ingame perhaps and I love bosses that are so big that they don't even fit on the screen!
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Quote NancyGold Replybullet Posted: 08 November 2017 at 12:17pm
Hapiel, that is nice, but real biplanes had cockpit below their top wings and tail was connected by two thin ledges.

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danieldiggle
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Quote danieldiggle Replybullet Posted: 09 November 2017 at 3:10pm
Thanks for all the advice and thoughts! - I tested out a few things, but I'm pretty happy with how this has come out now. Might still try and get a better reflection on the glass, but think I'll leave this boss for now and start moving onto some other game assets!



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Quote NancyGold Replybullet Posted: 09 November 2017 at 3:18pm
Yeah, new cockpit looks order of magnitude better.
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Hapiel
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Quote Hapiel Replybullet Posted: 09 November 2017 at 4:04pm
@snv: Find me one more biplane that isn't that one which has the tail connected like that :p

@Daniel:
Super work on the cockpit, nice! Now I'd kind off wish for a retake on the engines in the same style, this shading and detail without dithering works great!
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Quote NancyGold Replybullet Posted: 10 November 2017 at 3:52am
Originally posted by Hapiel

@snv: Find me one more biplane that isn't that one which has the tail connected like that :p

Ok.

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danieldiggle
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Quote danieldiggle Replybullet Posted: 16 November 2017 at 7:54am
Originally posted by Hapiel

@snv: Find me one more biplane that isn't that one which has the tail connected like that :p@Daniel:Super work on the cockpit, nice! Now I'd kind off wish for a retake on the engines in the same style, this shading and detail without dithering works great!


I did end up doing the engines in a similar way. Now just have to wait for my game partner to get back from holiday and start coding all this stuff!

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Quote NancyGold Replybullet Posted: 17 November 2017 at 6:36am
Cool! Are you planning blow-up animation?
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