WIP (Work In Progress)
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Peach
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Quote Peach Replybullet Topic: lightsources and ramps
    Posted: 16 May 2008 at 9:24am
hi all.. while I'm working on other things, I'm investigating in the lightsources and the colors to be used. First of all the result on human flesh (I've planned a chromed robot for metallic something).
I've seen a tut quite interesting, but experiencing is the best thing, and I must improve in the ramps to use.
Infact I'm also trying to understand the "right amount" of colors to be choosen for a ramp, instead of sticking to 5 each, as I did in the very first works

here I have put two light sources on her face: a bluish and a yellow/white on the other side.

What do you think? Did I choose the colors correctly? Did some errors in the color placement? Anything else to be noted?
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l3m0n5
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Quote l3m0n5 Replybullet Posted: 16 May 2008 at 2:23pm
Dithering is one thing that most people steer clear of when dealing with flesh tones and skin shading. This is because although it helps to mend 2 shades together, it also gives the implication of a rough texture/surface which, unless u were going for, does not seem to work for this piece.

Another issue i think is your peachy-flesh colors of which i can see some color which may be merged or just taken out because of their small contrast and almost no difference to the other colors.

Other than that, I'm liking ur secondary light-source and the hair as of now :D
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Peach
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Quote Peach Replybullet Posted: 16 May 2008 at 5:02pm
I tried to rearrange the Picasso's eyes ( :P ) and giving her a Diabolic's Eva suite, it seemd to me the most appropriate.
I tried also to remove the dithering on the face but I'm not really convinced of the result :(
19 colors so far (add the bg and white)

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Garrett
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Quote Garrett Replybullet Posted: 17 May 2008 at 8:26am
I think you have tried to make an hybrid dither-not dither (what's the opposite of dither?) and maybe that's why this does not convince you... better: it does not convince me =P
Another issue is the nose, if I were in you I'd refine it because it seems like broken or  with a sort of hunch to me, don't know...
I'd also remove that imperfection you can see in the lower left line of the face, but you are practicing with her face illumination, and it looks correct to me!

I think I have no other issue, except for a general line-refining in the body, but i'm sure you noticed it =P
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Metaru
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Quote Metaru Replybullet Posted: 17 May 2008 at 11:33am
opposite of dither = cell shading(sort of).

a few things i'd like to point:

  • dithering in the clothes looks fine, but it looks like the transcision between
  • the darkest and the lightest skin tones were some kind of scar. really, you don't need to dither everything, because not all trasncicion colors have to be as smooth as posible(hence the idea of contrast).
  • for such a strong lightsource you're apliying in the face, the hair should be affected by it aswell.
  • the shading of the face is a bit inacurate. its not really following the features of it, thus not helping to give an idea of volume.
finally, your palette could be improved a bit. your darkest browns and red are almost the same, same for your dark green that goes practically unnoticed unless you zoom to spot it on the eye(try replacing it with black). and the contrast in your blue palette could be improved also, as the first and third colors are virtually the same. better take one out or make them more useful(since the purple one is used as an outline).
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Peach
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Quote Peach Replybullet Posted: 18 May 2008 at 4:53am
ok, tried to improve the shading of the face, the skin tones, and the palette.
I've removed the dithering in the face, but I didn't get what Metaru said about the clothes and the trasition

[edit] in fact the problem with the shading was inherited by the original sketch that was to much deformed :(


Edited by Peach - 18 May 2008 at 4:55am
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skamocore
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Quote skamocore Replybullet Posted: 18 May 2008 at 5:45am
Ok I did a bit of an edit.

I think one of your main problems was light source confusion...you have this really strong light coming from the right...however the left side of her face is still extremely bright. Most of the illumination in the scene seems like it should be from the right.


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Peach
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Quote Peach Replybullet Posted: 18 May 2008 at 6:03am
@skamocore: there are actually two light sources, a blu on the right of the piece and a white one on the left. I should add more light to the swimsuit on the left, cause the intensity of the lights are quite similar, or at least this was my first intention, and the study I'm doing is actually this.
You actually removed a dithering that was quite confusing on the right.


Edited by Peach - 18 May 2008 at 6:08am
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skamocore
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Quote skamocore Replybullet Posted: 18 May 2008 at 6:27am
ah sorry, I did read that you had 2 light sources originally...but kinda slipped my mind...

The thing is that the white light source only seemed to illuminate a really small part of her face, and a tiny bit of hair. Therefore if you are going for two strong lightsources make sure they are both causing a strong sense of lighting.

I suggest getting an object and two lights and actually observing how the light sources interact with the object.
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Peach
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Quote Peach Replybullet Posted: 18 May 2008 at 8:47am
I actually found a woman face illuminated on the right in this way and I'm going to work in that direction. I'm quite unsure on the color to get the light part of the suit.
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Peach
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Quote Peach Replybullet Posted: 18 May 2008 at 6:24pm
latest version:

was thinking in adding a pistol in a holster on her waist but I don't know if it is too much stereotyped, btw I hope I get the correct shading for the face, it's really difficult... at least without a physical ref.


Edited by Peach - 18 May 2008 at 6:38pm
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Metaru
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Quote Metaru Replybullet Posted: 18 May 2008 at 10:22pm
the texture looks wonderful, but it doesn't seem to be what you should for hair. unless she's wearing some kind of foam made wig/helmet wich i don't believe is the case.

and about the thin i didn't finish in my previous post(the first point) was that "dithering in the clothes looks fine, but using it as a transicion in the face makes it look like a terrible scar"

also, would you mind posting the reference you're using for the face ilumination?
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Peach
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Quote Peach Replybullet Posted: 19 May 2008 at 4:21am
I'm using this
http://www.sxc.hu/photo/962112
just for the left light.
As you also noted, I'm not really satisfied with the hairs, I should work hard on the volume and illumination, I'll try to add more colors to make a better transistion..
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Metaru
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Quote Metaru Replybullet Posted: 19 May 2008 at 11:00am
if you look carefully, you'll see that in the eyebrow the transition works perfectly. in the lowe part of the face it doesn't. in other words, you must use the midtone as a simple transition for the lightest and darkest skin tones in a more limited way.

I believe this is a more accurate aproximation to your reference.

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Quote Peach Replybullet Posted: 20 May 2008 at 5:05pm
you were totally right, so I kept your edit more or less pixel.
Then I tried to give a shade to the hair, and added that pistol :-\

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Metaru
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Quote Metaru Replybullet Posted: 20 May 2008 at 5:58pm
the hair can't be that shinny. it is a reflective surface indeed, but even with a strong ligthsource over ir it gets a very limited reflect. try to be more subtle, because apart from the fact is a bit overdone, you want the viewer to focus on her face-eyes, not in her hair.

the pistol looks great, but should be shaded following the image's scheme. this is, using big black areas.
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skamocore
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Quote skamocore Replybullet Posted: 20 May 2008 at 9:56pm
I think you're getting much closer now, and as met said maybe you've gone a bit overboard with the shine. I think you should keep a similar style but just tone down the brightness.

Also the pistol looks good, however its completely unnecessary. I would just stick to refining the picture as much as possible instead of adding extra parts to it. Maybe keep the belt though, that seems to work well, before it looked like she was just a floating torso
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Peach
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Quote Peach Replybullet Posted: 21 May 2008 at 8:16am
ok, tried to lower down the light on the hair

this seems to me more balanced.
I'm working on a two dark color background. let see what I can get :P
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Garrett
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Quote Garrett Replybullet Posted: 21 May 2008 at 8:49am
The light seems okay to me, but just a question: is the light purple or it's my monitor that needs a color balancing?
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Peach
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Quote Peach Replybullet Posted: 21 May 2008 at 9:00am
you mean the right light? is bluish/violet-something yes. even if I'm very bad at naming colors, I think a color balanced monitor is always useful :)
edit: here's with a islamic-architecture background...

maybe not the right one... I'm just guessing, I'm partially satisfied with the img itself and I don't know if it's the right step to take.


Edited by Peach - 21 May 2008 at 10:31am
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Garrett
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Quote Garrett Replybullet Posted: 21 May 2008 at 12:25pm
Well i don't know much about islamic architecture but it does not give me the feeling that's really islamic... (sapevo che l'arco a tutto sesto era peculiaritą romanica!)
Anyway the background seems to have a different illumination than the character, looks like a pasted image on a background.
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Peach
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Quote Peach Replybullet Posted: 21 May 2008 at 1:14pm
hehehee actually these shouldn't be roman arches... never mind :)
You are right about the pasted image... I was looking for some archeological-something background, but I should think about it more
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skamocore
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Quote skamocore Replybullet Posted: 21 May 2008 at 1:17pm
100% agree...read what I wrote before about not trying to add more to the image. Stick with getting the girl as good as possible.

The background is actually really nice, but doesn't suit the image at all. I would actually submit both character and background as separate pieces. 

Also, remember how this image was just supposed to be a lighting test on human flesh??
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Metaru
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Quote Metaru Replybullet Posted: 21 May 2008 at 5:59pm
and how this poor girl is lacking hair below the ear.

the hair should even more darken. aim for subtle lines that represents the 'texture' of hair, not how to make it as shinny as posible. as you migth see, all the highlighs you've used in the body are there for that reason: to help define shapes without having to outline them at all.
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Peach
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Quote Peach Replybullet Posted: 29 May 2008 at 3:46am
totally agree.
Since in these days I've very few spare time to dedicate onto this I've tried to diminish the light on the hair as you suggested:

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Peach
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Quote Peach Replybullet Posted: 30 May 2008 at 10:13am
posted on PJ.
think it finished now: http://pixeljoint.com/pixelart/32761.htm
vertigo helpd me finishing the face :) now it's less flat and neither fat
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