Dolphin Snake
Printed From: Pixel Joint
Category: Pixel Art
Forum Name: WIP (Work In Progress)
Forum Discription: Get crits and comments on your pixel WIPs and other art too!
URL: https://pixeljoint.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9567
Printed Date: 30 June 2026 at 1:58pm
Topic: Dolphin Snake
Posted By: Buddy90
Subject: Dolphin Snake
Date Posted: 16 December 2009 at 12:54pm
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Hello, I submitted this piece, but I got a message saying that it didn't a high enough score to be in the gallery. What could I do to improve it?  |
Replies:
Posted By: Dhr. Bosch
Date Posted: 16 December 2009 at 3:45pm
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your shading could be improved and you'r lines could be much cleaner. you should also look at the volume of the snake/dolphin, it seems inconsistant in thickness. the look on it's face is awesome though ------------- Vanitas, vanitatum omnia vanitas |
Posted By: Buddy90
Date Posted: 16 December 2009 at 5:33pm
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Ok, I tried to fix the lines and add anti-aliasing. Old one on the left, new one on the right.  Are there are any other problems with it that I could fix? |
Posted By: Delicious
Date Posted: 16 December 2009 at 6:10pm
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Your AA on the transition with the lighter and darker blue seems to be a huge waste, as the shade colour does not get any brighter to blend in with the light shade, and only gets to a stronger contrast, which basically makes it unoticable and possibly worse.
I could do an edit for you, and if I finish it I will post it here.
This is turning out great, none the less! So keep pushing.
 Alright, the only thing I really did was show you what you could possibly do with the line work instead and how to AA from the shadow and main colour transition also a new way to shade to make it look less flat. It is not polished, obviousily, but perhaps you could look at it a bit? The only part that was really worked on was the head, so take a look at that - The rest was just mainly to show you what you could do for the line work. Anyways, keep it up man, you are improving from the first edit.
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Posted By: Buddy90
Date Posted: 16 December 2009 at 8:14pm
So, I decided to start over from the beginning. Thanks for that you gave I was able to make this. You think I should submit it to the gallery again or is there something else that I didn't catch? |
Posted By: Hatch
Date Posted: 16 December 2009 at 8:17pm
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The eyes, particularly the left one, should be moved to the right (our left, our right), and you should get rid of the black line separating the white from the blue. It makes no sense there. ------------- |
Posted By: Delicious
Date Posted: 16 December 2009 at 9:33pm
| Improved a ton! Also, I agree with everything that Hatch is suggesting. :) |
Posted By: Buddy90
Date Posted: 16 December 2009 at 9:52pm
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Posted By: jeremy
Date Posted: 16 December 2009 at 9:53pm
:P As the contrast generally is so low the AA is pretty ineffectual. The colours could do with some hue shifting as the ramps are so straight, white does not need to be shaded with grey; try purples! Blue in particular can look real nice shaded in purples and highlighted in greener, more cyan colours. |
Posted By: Buddy90
Date Posted: 16 December 2009 at 11:51pm
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Aw, they still didn't want it in the gallery. OK, now let's go into this more in-depth. The colors are 9, including transparency. Its white, gray, light gray, black, and 4 shades of blue.  Is it because it's not conservative enough? Are many of the colors useless? Is the lineart still too choppy? Are the shadows too blah? I'll pick this up again tomorrow. Thanks for your help this far, I am liking the progress it's making :) |
Posted By: DrunkBurger
Date Posted: 17 December 2009 at 1:46am
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Only submit it to the gallery when you are 100% done with your work. Now you look like you just edit a few things and then try again, make it your work and don't think that getting it into the gallery is the highest point you can reach. Good luck. ------------- ~Mo Money Mo Bitches~ |
Posted By: jeremy
Date Posted: 17 December 2009 at 3:41am
| Also, white backgrounds aren't accepted. Either transparify or choose one which helps the piece :) |
Posted By: Manupix
Date Posted: 17 December 2009 at 5:33am
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My problem with this piece is, I can't relate to it. What's a dolphin snake? do they live in water or on the ground, are they a natural hybrid or some mad scientist's dream, is there just one, does he like being one? Maybe you have the answers to those questions, if not I suggest you think about it. I'm not saying you have to tell us, just that your art will have more life in it if you know more about it. Then I think some answers to the more technical aspects would become obvious. Also, I totally agree with DrunkB: the main point about showing your art is to improve, the main fun about art is doing it. I understand you want to have something in your gallery, we all do, just be patient and keep working. Not all pieces have a gallery future, all are useful as learning stages. This one has already noticeably improved, I've no doubt you'll make it soon! |
Posted By: Hatch
Date Posted: 17 December 2009 at 8:26am
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Even though you've removed the black line between the blue and white, you're still using darker pixels there. This just calls attention to the jaggedness; you should use antialiasing to smooth the transition.
Also, the eyes are still not positioned properly. Use the "beak" (for want of a better word) as the marker for the center of the head. The right eye (our right) should be foreshortened by the curve of the skull. Work on your curves a bit more. Many of them feel jagged or boxy, and the top of his body on the left side of his neck doesn't match up with the right side. ------------- |
Posted By: pikselima
Date Posted: 17 December 2009 at 11:36am
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Originally posted by Hatch
Work on your curves a bit more. Many of them feel jagged or boxy, and the top of his body on the left side of his neck doesn't match up with the right side. Yeap. I think the biggest problem are the lines, they look kinda wierd. |
Posted By: Buddy90
Date Posted: 17 December 2009 at 2:53pm
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OK, so the dolphin snake is called Snadol. It's supposed to be a Pokemon. I also want to try to imitate the style of the sprites in Pokemon Diamond/Pearl, and from these sprites I've inferred       80x80 size, 16 colors including transparency. I work on GraphicsGale, btw. Ok, so I thought my old one was a big too big, 116x118 ( i think). Too big for a small file, kinda small for a detail file. So, I wanna try to use 16 colors on a 80x80 canvas. I think the part that could use most improvement is my lines. I have a hard time making it curvy without getting into jags. Here is the new lineart.  I want to get this part perfect before I move on to color ramps and shading. What can I do to fix this? P.S. I know it's not transparent. I just leave it white for now, that's the last step I do. The grid represents the color pallete, right now it just has black, transparent, and white. |
Posted By: Manupix
Date Posted: 17 December 2009 at 4:08pm
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No problem with white, this is not the gallery. Quick edit:  I see several problems with your lines. One is strictly technical: drawing smooth curves. Yours generally tend inward. I'd recommend practicing perfect circles of all sizes, you will quickly understand the idea and be able to apply it to any curve. It is important to constantly check your piece at 100 or 200% max, almost after every other pixel. You can't easily see those problems at the larger scales. Then, you can give the guy more dynamic, cartoony lines by accentuating some shapes. I didn't go far enough in this, mostly because I'm no good at it! This is where the 'idea(s)' underlying the character should guide your choices. (I would also have made him taller, maybe by as much as one head: he looks very, very short, right from the start) One small technical point: in some places I outlined in green, you have 'banding', meaning similar clusters on two close lines. Try to avoid this at all cost! Another good thing you may have done already is to check some ref. Google snakes and dolphins, and practice drawing them on paper. When you've done some, you might find you have a better understanding of what are the important shapes that instantly scream 'i'm a dolphin' to the viewer. |
Posted By: smk
Date Posted: 17 December 2009 at 5:18pm
| Just dropped by to say, DON'T GIVE UP! You're getting better and better results :) |
Posted By: Buddy90
Date Posted: 17 December 2009 at 5:49pm
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So, I wanted to try a photoshop drawing first, to get a better idea.  I decided to drop the dolphin idea, make it a regular snake, change the eyes, make him skinnier, and longer. I came out with this. The little tail on the end was a real pain.  I also changed the body line in the middle. I'll do that without an outline, or drop it altogether. I'm not giving up on this guy. I don't care if I have to spend all winter break on it! EDIT: Wanted to do color/shade it too.  8 colors. |
Posted By: Buddy90
Date Posted: 19 December 2009 at 1:50am
| No one has anymore advice? :( |
Posted By: Petrichor
Date Posted: 19 December 2009 at 2:03am
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Looking MUCH better. Two things: 1. The back of his neck/whatever (oh, snake anatomy!) where it goes into the curve is a little thin and harsh. It's like he very suddenly has a lump in his middle. Just smooth out that black line and I think you're golden, anatomywise. 2. You have two ramps here, but you're not letting them overlap even though they're all shades of green. You can really get more use out of them by using some of the darker greens to AA the underside: the black lineart against that pale belly is harsh! Alternately, you could just tint the belly-line to be a colour other than black. Ideally, you'd combine the two techniques. You could apply this to the tooth, too, which could use some AA to make it more of a triangle and less of a clearly-pixeled... someshapethatisntatriangle, haha. The eyebrow would benefit from some AA--maybe. The more I look the more I'm not sure... it looks pretty good at x1 as it is. 3. (okay three things) The highlight on the head is a little too front-and-center and tiny and defined. It doesn't really define the creature's shape, although it does help define your lightsource. Dramatic improvement, sir. :D Major deja vu here. I keep getting the feeling someone's going to beat me to this. |
Posted By: Buddy90
Date Posted: 19 December 2009 at 12:59pm
 1. Straightened out the jag in his neck. 2. AA the belly, tooth, eyebrow, and some other things. 3. Selective outlining. 4. Replaced brown for a darker green 5. Widened the highlights on the nose and head. |
Posted By: Delicious
Date Posted: 19 December 2009 at 2:36pm
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Just stopping in to say that I can't believe how much you improved. Great work! Keep going, man.
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Posted By: Buddy90
Date Posted: 20 December 2009 at 2:28pm
OK, so I tried to make more fishy with fins...  And a third color change, lol. |
Posted By: Falciase
Date Posted: 21 December 2009 at 12:39am
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Great improvement man, keep it up! Looks good so far. I personally like the green better than the brown though :P Also, your outlines are kinda weird, perhaps too many colors on the outlines...? I may would look better with just black... but that might just be my preference. Great work!! |
Posted By: Manupix
Date Posted: 21 December 2009 at 2:33pm
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Much better lines! Why not include both versions in one image? Like, sea and land cousins meeting. Agree about outlines, looks like you've tried to imitate anti-aliasing for a dark bg. Shading is a bit inconsistent in places: what's that shadow on the lower left corner? The fin on the neck is weird, too large for niceness of composition, and anatomically you wouldn't expect it so high. Maybe have 2 smaller and lower? |