Wing movement itself is fantastic. I think that the head would extend more as wings go down.

The animation is quite slow too. What sort of frame speed are you using? 'Cos if it's too small some browsers may automatically slow down to 1/10s.

Can't wait to see it rendered! Is it for something in particular, or just for fun? :D

lil update:


its time to start fleshing it out :D

Your absolutely right! That's why I love crit I couldnt see it my self. This project I think has been more about the study of a wave motion than of a proper wing.
Thank you so much i m going to redesign the body, probably with a much shorter neck and mid section, and redesign the wing. I never realized the wing movement from extreme to extreme is so minimal. (talking about bats)
found an awesome profile view of the bat in slow motion flight:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEP-KgJkYnw
this is the ref i will use, the wings on the bat are incredible.

love you snader!

And now it looks to stiff :/

I enjoyed the floppy wings. He might not be able to fly with them but it sure looks cool. Tail was nice too. I'd say that you should just fix the head.

Your previous wip looks like some sort of mix between a fly and a swimming animation. You just had to get rid of the swimming part.

It was beautiful the first time! *cries* I actually liked how the dragon moved it's body. It's like a mystical dragon, the ones that don't even use wings to fly, you know?

@lucas
thanks i agree with the stiffness, and your right the first one looks like a swim, the body is my best wave ive animated.

@ zer
not sure how i would fix the wings of the first one, i used no real life ref, no strucutre and no thought to how air would be is incorporated.

@bannana
hehe i could just slap that label on it, but for where i want to take this sprite i need structure and im glad it seems more realistic.

The first was a nice start project to this, really warmed me up to wave theory which i need to use in the tail of the final.
I realized i didnt plan the tail out very well in the second dragon, i figured i d just slap a nice wave on it and be done with it. well while animating the tail i realized there are some serious flaws in my design and animation.

The biggest problem is that he floats up and down at opposite times from when he should, also his body is much to tiled / forward, working on a timing chart on paper and drawing the extreme frames or keys with only the skeleton have made me realize i have to start over again.

However the good news is 2 days off starting now! :D so hopefully it will be quick, Thank you for your feed back it really helps, and was actually surprised everyone liked the first of the two better :D

oh for some reason that makes sense now. didnt really before and your absolutly right. we ll see what comes next

i really like your new avatar :D

lol i guess i was tired last night i forgot to upload the inbetweens i finished.
i went with a 6 frame cycle
i think the tail looks funny, maybe the first wave needs to be reduced, any suggestions?

in game each flap will move the sprite up with code, after i get this flap cycle done i will work on a glide, which will act like a default animation cycle while not flapping to regain elevation.

i tried to add a bit more fluid movement to the wings, i might need to double up the frames and smooth it out to really get the effect.. not sure yet

I thiiink that the head should be seen to extend downwards as the wings rise. The circular motion of the legs is a bit odd too.

@ NaCl
thanks :) you make some very good points, some times i get so focuses on mimicking reality you forget what animation is all about.

I changed a frame to expose the head, i think it helps alot, as well gave the head more of a downward movement during flap down motion. and touched up the sketched feet, working on touching up the outside lines and cleaning up the line drawing, im still not sure on colors, the dragon will be against dark greys in stormy cloudy skies , so im thinking brighter colors.. thank you for all, for all the help



*possibly need more head movement possible an angle change, and the feet i think dangle a bit too much still

Lol, yes we all love snader. maybe i will polish off the first one to release as a pixel art piece, everyone loves it... but this 2nd or i mean 3rd generation is more suiting for the little game im creating, so yea all effort is going this way right now and all the crit is helping alot, heres an update not much has changed now working on the feet and soon colors! :D




Edited by Sippy_Cup - 18 November 2010 at 7:48pm

thats a good point i would think it would be slower going down cause of the resistance of pushing the air down. hmm i could try to re draw it a bit, or i could speed up the animation all together.. let me try that first, also here is updated line quality is done, and heres a break down of the 6 frames so each can be analyzed individually, let me know on my pixels :D

*same speed as before*


*sped up animation*


*frame break down*

I think the first dragon wasnt even his lol

Anyways
the new one looks like he is flying backwards

I can see what Elk means about it looking as if it's flying backwards. It's just because rather than the wings falling where they are in the shoulders, they move forwards slightly, looking like as if it's trying to push itself through the air backwards. Still better than anything I could do, though. Good look with your game!

Dude, just draw each frame on it's own. It's clear you're taking shortcuts with copying and pasting, and it's really ruining it. The timing on the wings is still way off.

@nacl yes ive been copying and pasting the body, i dont really see the problem coping and pasting it, yes it looks stiff, but right now the focus is the wings, and theres very little i copy and paste from wing frames. in the end i ll be going through every pixel and manuallly manipulating them.
and yes your right i do it to save time, i m lucky if i have an hour a night free to work towards this.

but i need some feed back on the wings, the timing isnt right yet, but do they look better flapping past the body like in the last update or how i had it before?

well because you exactly said it. the wings dont just affect the creatures movement in my mind they 'drive' the movements.

when i did the first animation i actually animated the body and wings independently from each other.

i first animated the body as it would be the easiest task. in my mind the dragon should swim through the air because hes like a snake; this inicial thought of how it should move was completely wrong *it also has twice as many frames as my current animation so it looks much smoother and better animated*
i than tackled the wings, no reference just how i thought i saw it in my mind. they get their heavy look because the tips of the wings drag behind the part of the wing connected to the body, i hope that makes sense its hard to explain but i applied a wave theory to them so the 'inner' or part of the wing thats connected to the body moves first and the rest sluggishly trails behind. i defiantly like the first animation as well but a few comments really helped me put the project into perspective. if this was just for fun i would stick with the original dragon and i still might go back to it, but where i want this project to go is to create a very believable creature in a believable world, with out drawing up a bunch of concepts its hard to explain the artistic style i want the game.

im having the hardest time with the wings, and because of some of the changes ive made  like rearranging frames and how the inbetweens hug the keys the body gets all messed up, so i ve kinda stopped worrying about the body all together until i figure out how these blasted wings will look.
yea maybe im taking short cuts and it hurts it but thats why this is wip and i have to give your suggestions a try otherwise what will i learn ;)
so i will work on dynamically working the body more have it flow and move closer to the original dragon design.

i was going to wrap up and say because the wings are driving the movements of everything else i wanted to get them down right and than work on the body, but the longer i thought about it you are all probably right i will yield a better result working on them together in unison.

uhg i try to avoid posts like this, sorry.

heres an update, i started on a fresh canvas and redrew it, way past my bed time, want to fix the head and tail, head does a double bob and i want to slow it down to a single bob, as well theres a few errors in the end of the tail in a few frames.

Thanks H|F, there is a lot of useful footage in that link and personally the silhouette of the bird flying away seeing it from behind is my favorite!
kinda makes me sad my game is side-scrolling :(

the dragon will fly up and glide down, maybe ill add a dive function, but you flap to regain elevation, and glide, the point is to hit the ground with your fire and burn the village.

heres the current: there are things i like and dislike about it and very tempted to start fresh again... sigh.



let me know what you think where the biggest flaws lay, if you want me to speed it up i will, it seems a bit slow.. than again maybe its just the tail thats slow

testing out some colors, cleaned up the frames a bit

Thanks H|F its finally getting there, i cant wait to get to the pixeling. The lines on the top of the wings at this point its mainly just for structural tracking, maybe for coloring later. Thank you for pointing that out, i haven't given it much consideration. Even though the arms wont show in the top, a definition should defiantly be there.

Im going to work on the neck and tail now let me know about the head i might keep the tilt in it, heres a quick update missing the neck, i think it looks a lot better, a straight neck would look good with maybe a little bit of a flex during direction change. also i think ill shorten the gap between head and shoulder.

the tail doesnt move according to the wings

i get what you mean elk, tail goes up and down at the wrong times, anyways i had an idea, so here it is sketched in a lighter color


i like it,to me it feels like its moving with the dragon. remember that in game this animation takes place when the dragon flaps its wings and gains elevation, so with code the sprite will move along the y axis. and during 'rest' or default the dragon will glide and slowly loose elevation.

anyways thanks hf! your crit has been very helpful! and surprisingly im not that sick of it i just wish it was done :) the pixeling is going to take some time i suspect since thats where my skills are the weakest.

Excellent job so far on this.

Alright Delicious heres an extra frame in the up flap, had to smooth out the tail a bit to get an extra frame to fit in there
lemme know if it helps..



Edited by Sippy_Cup - 28 November 2010 at 5:51pm