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Geki
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Quote Geki Replybullet Topic: RPG character and NPA: Sketch of character
    Posted: 08 February 2008 at 8:03am
Hi, I'm really new at this whole pixel thing but I've given up on finding an artist for my java game for now and I'm going to use placeholder pixel art made by none other than ME!

So here's the sketch I made NPA:


http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/1633/grakairesizedou8.jpg

And again with some quick temp color to give you an idea:

http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/2034/grakaicolorcm6.jpg

And here are the two first frames of him looking down and right. Not the final versions.





I think the colors may be wrong so tell me what you think :/ Maybe I should make his hair a bit smaller and his head more roundish.

There's going to be 1 more frame for looking up. The looking right frame will be mirrored in game by the engine I made. I think I'll do 3 walking/running frames in the up down and right direction. But I've never done animation before so If you have some tips or sites I could go to for help, feel free too share.

[EDIT:] the sword will be added as a single seperate sprite on it's own. It will be rotated by the engine to fit each frame of his animation. I allready made this part and it looks really well on the pre-placeholder graphic

back is done and yeah I'm slow at this:






Edited by Geki - 08 February 2008 at 2:05pm
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Inventrix
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Quote Inventrix Replybullet Posted: 08 February 2008 at 9:00am
His hair looks very fluffy on the sprites.  He has smooth hair in your sketches, though. o.O

Also, please don't make the images links, it makes it hard to use the nifty PJ image zoom feature.
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Geki
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Quote Geki Replybullet Posted: 08 February 2008 at 9:22am
His hair looks very fluffy on the sprites.  He has smooth hair in your sketches, though. o.O


Yeah i know. But everytime I try to make the hair smaller his head seems smaller as well. Maybe I should keep the same size and just try to even out the edges so it doesnt get the fluffy feel to it.. I'll be back with the result later.




Edited by Geki - 08 February 2008 at 2:34pm
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Geki
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Quote Geki Replybullet Posted: 09 February 2008 at 4:18am
Here is the horizontal walking animation all done. Tell me if you see something odd in the animation, pixel errors and things jumping where they shouldnt or stuff like that.


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Geki
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Quote Geki Replybullet Posted: 09 February 2008 at 7:34am

Walking south



And north



His sword



With the sword in hand


Next up, the three attack frames for north west and south.




Edited by Geki - 09 February 2008 at 8:06am
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Inventrix
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Quote Inventrix Replybullet Posted: 09 February 2008 at 8:52am
For the animation walking to the side, it seems as though you have an extra frame in the part where he moves the leg closer to the viewer forwards.

Also I think you left a stray pixel on the right shoulder of the running up animation, on the frame where the arm is moving back.

The hair looks better. :)  What happened to the blue for his pants, though?
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Geki
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Quote Geki Replybullet Posted: 09 February 2008 at 8:58am
Lol, i forgot I made the pants blue on the picture...hmmm and yeah I see the stray pixel i will fix it later. And for the first animation I think thats just because i either lefta frame out or doubled one of the frames in the animation. Never done animation before so I make a lot of mistakes.
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Quote Squirrelsquid Replybullet Posted: 09 February 2008 at 9:55am
you do realize that your sword on the character itself is transformed using the evil, occult mechanics of antialiased rotation turning it into NPA? besides, it's heavily pillowshaded...
vote for squirrels crates!
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Geki
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Quote Geki Replybullet Posted: 09 February 2008 at 11:09am
you do realize that your sword on the character itself is transformed using the evil, occult mechanics of antialiased rotation turning it into NPA? besides, it's heavily pillowshaded...


Nope I didn't notice it got anti-aliased. Sorry about that. I just used the photoshop rotation. I doubt java's 2dgraphics will anti alias it unless I tell it to do so in the game though. So I hope it will look better in there.
And since I'm really really new at this I have no idea of what pillowshaded means?

EDIT: I know what it means now. And yeah it really is. I find it hard to shade right since he's going to be swinging this single image around.


Edited by Geki - 09 February 2008 at 11:20am
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Hapiel
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Quote Hapiel Replybullet Posted: 09 February 2008 at 12:26pm
Only rotations from 90 degrees can be NPA. the rest will never get the way you want it.
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Geki
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Quote Geki Replybullet Posted: 09 February 2008 at 12:50pm
Horizontal attack done..sigh... I'm so slow at this 



I'm thinking I'll keep the black pants color.. maybe...
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Quote Geki Replybullet Posted: 09 February 2008 at 12:51pm
Only rotations from 90 degrees can be NPA. the rest will never get the way you want it.


Yeah well hopefully the animation will be so fast you won't be able to notice the small errors. Looked nice with the previous placeholders.
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Geki
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Quote Geki Replybullet Posted: 10 February 2008 at 5:12am

Attacking north:


And south:


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Geki
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Quote Geki Replybullet Posted: 10 February 2008 at 5:45am

wee, his power level is OVER 9000!
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Quote beta Replybullet Posted: 10 February 2008 at 6:48am
hi. I thought the char looked aweseom but it looked like in the walking south animation that his shoulders were forward and he looked pretty focused, but on the walking north anim his shoulders are up and leaning backwards so it looks like he is walking with feet first, even that he might be backing off from something.

Also with the attack north his lower body doesnt move at all but in the attack east his knees are quite active.
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Quote Inventrix Replybullet Posted: 10 February 2008 at 8:59am
The attack south looks unfortunately like the character is weeding with excessive amounts of energy. 

I think his arms are too long when held straight out to the sides in the uh... charging animation?  By like, one pixel.
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Quote spartan_117 Replybullet Posted: 10 February 2008 at 9:49am
Firstly, 90% of the posts here are yours alone, it is no use talking to your self.
Secondly, a word of advice, before animating a thousand different moves all of them flawed, work on one and make it perfect, then go on to the next one (it's better to play a good demo than a crappy game).
Thirdly, some more advice, try working more on the character concept before doing any sprites even if it's NPA.
Finally, I find the attacking sprites hard to comprehend,maybe try something with a sword.

good luck anyway.
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Quote MurrMan Replybullet Posted: 10 February 2008 at 11:29am
is it just me or do these look like traces of chrono from chrono trigger? the motions look very much the same.
I have plenty of emotions; It is Sleep that i lack
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Metaru
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Quote Metaru Replybullet Posted: 11 February 2008 at 6:14pm
these appear bto be edits of Chrono's Sprite with cropped frames.



I ate leel's babies
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Quote Hatch Replybullet Posted: 11 February 2008 at 6:50pm
It doesn't look anything like an edit of Crono to me. Overlay the sprites.
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Quote skamocore Replybullet Posted: 11 February 2008 at 7:16pm
maybe inspired...but the sprites are pretty different

head movement more exaggerated and bouncy
shadow stays still
arm swings differently

although...now I feel like playing CT...
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Metaru
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Quote Metaru Replybullet Posted: 11 February 2008 at 8:27pm
what i would think:
while the general animation of the sprite is quite good, on both desing and color, the desing of the sword is terrible, pillowshaded and flat.

perhaps not of CT, but maybe an edit of another game's sprite. I'm sure i've seen that horizontal attack animation somewhere.
please, just compare all these sequences with the 'powerup' one.
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Quote Geki Replybullet Posted: 12 February 2008 at 1:16am
I did use the old Secret Of Mana sprites to do his movement and stuff since I've never done any kind of animation on my own I needed a reference of some sort.
I don't know why you'r all so fixated on chrono trigger but I agree it was one of the best SNES games made. If it had been released half a year earlier it would've rocked the the world (more than it does now).
If you could recommend any guides on pixel animation I'd be delighted to try them out.

And I know the sword is horribly pillowshaded, probably won't use it in the game anyway since it's way too big.
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Quote Metaru Replybullet Posted: 12 February 2008 at 9:58am
so, in the end it is an edit of an sprite. you'll better clarify such important aspect from the begining, since such actions are forbidden in this site. you now, no one wants to lite a torch and call you ripper.
 
the resource forums contains lots of animation tutorial that will help you, but instead i would focus on learning the basics of colors, shading, and other important stuff that you partially lack at this point, rather than moving into something more 'advanced' as animations. once you got the basics, you'll find yourself on the rigth way to achive your goal.
 
so you would not need to edit an sprite again, here.
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Geki
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Quote Geki Replybullet Posted: 13 February 2008 at 7:37am
Well I did redo the sprite from the bottum and up, and used the poses as a reference. I humbly apologize if that is not allowed. Anyway i'm done with this one and won't add anything more. I'll add him to my game and call it a wrap.
Thank you for telling me there was a resource forum. It's helped me out a lot. I'll do a new concept character and do a higher resolution 100% original character if I can. I feel inspired after looking through the tutorials thats for sure. Thx for your help :) and sorry for being such a noob (pillowshading etc.)


Edited by Geki - 13 February 2008 at 7:37am
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Quote Hatch Replybullet Posted: 13 February 2008 at 3:46pm
Originally posted by Geki

Well I did redo the sprite from the bottum and up, and used the poses as a reference.

Don't lie to us:


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Quote Sonic_Reaper Replybullet Posted: 13 February 2008 at 6:19pm

You guys are too hard on him.  I personally have nothing against edits so long as they look completely different from the originals.

Having said that though ... I don't know if there's anything redeeming here.  For starters, the design of the characters just ... isn't very good.  I would avize against use large amounts of grey in any design.  Grey is just so lifeless and boring.
 
I would personally rework the design first and foremost before moving on to anything else.  You're kinda jumping head first into the fray of things.
 
As for the sprite itself;
 
- get rid of the rediculous outlines.  It looks especially bad on the hair where it clashes so heavily with the white.
- try a less zombie-like skin tone.  At the moment, the skin tone is really dirty and washed out looking.  This is further made apparent by your use of yellow.  Be careful in how you use yellow.  Generally, against other light colors, it tends to wash everything out.  Yellow is best used as a contrasting color against darker and richer colors (red, blue and greens).  Looks awful against skin tones.


Edited by Sonic_Reaper - 13 February 2008 at 6:21pm
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Quote Monkey 'o Doom Replybullet Posted: 13 February 2008 at 7:07pm
The problem with making edits is that it's stealing. If he had told us that he was working off of the sprites from Secret of Mana, we would have been less hard on him but still told him to make entirely original art. Using without attributing is dishonest, and what was done here was deceptive and wasn't helping him grow as an artist. That's why it's frowned upon. Studying "the greats" is an excellent way to learn once you under stand the basics, but if you don't (like the poster here doesn't), you need to learn them first, or else you'll have no foundation in the concepts.
 
To clarify, this isn't even "studying." This is just painting over, and I don't know how it will help with anything beyond mouse control, which generally isn't a problem.


Edited by Monkey 'o Doom - 13 February 2008 at 7:09pm

RPG is numberwang.
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Geki
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Quote Geki Replybullet Posted: 14 February 2008 at 8:14am
Harsh words, but well deserved. Okay, I will learn drawing from the bottom up before I ever try this again, I promise. Hopefully some day I'll be able to meet your standards and return with something original and worthwhile. I thought I was creating an original sprite just using the movements from the original snes sprite but I see now that it's just too similar and realise I should start from scratch. I didn't mean to offend anyone but I can see why seasoned artists would frown upon this.




Edited by Geki - 14 February 2008 at 8:18am
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Metaru
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Quote Metaru Replybullet Posted: 14 February 2008 at 6:36pm
great to hear those words from you. now less drama and more art please. ;)
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Quote MurrMan Replybullet Posted: 16 February 2008 at 3:04pm
Originally posted by Sonic_Reaper

You guys are too hard on him.

Originally posted by Sonic_Reaper

I don't know if there's anything redeeming here.  For starters, the design of the characters just ... isn't very good.

 
Ironic? I think so...
besides the irony i agree with the statement presented by Sonic Reaper
 
What i suggest is that you start a new project because you probably wont get much benefit from the comments posted in this topic, what with the scadelous edits and such.
What i will do is comment on the work you have made to these sprites. this can be used for you to develope.
 
First white hair can work with sprites, but what you have here looks like solid white. There is almost no contrast. you need some shadows, not grey but colored ones like pink or light blue... some light shade of any color you feel suits your concept.
 
second, you are inconsistant with your outlineing. the hair and body have a black outlines and the sword doesnt. I really needs an outline.
 
thirdly, the sword completely obscures the character. This is where you would have the character hold it in the other hand, or change his stance to holding it behind him... or make it goddamn smaller.
 
Fourthly, that sword just looks like crap, conceptually and in the art of pixel sence.
 
P.S.  Secret of mana. That is what i was thinking of...
i know what threw me off; its that sprite of your character doing the very luminare esk mover whith his hair moving.
I have plenty of emotions; It is Sleep that i lack
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