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jwgamedesign
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Quote jwgamedesign Replybullet Topic: New to sprites, need help!
    Posted: 07 June 2013 at 1:18pm
Hey everyone. I'm pretty new to sprites. I've dabbled in them before, but I want to take a step further. Below is some work in progress slime enemies for a game. Critiques welcomed.



In order, but not all shown, their names are:
Pups - Little guys that stick to the player and slow
Nups - Damage the player by biting
Gups - Try to gobble the player whole
Zups - Attack at range (working on design)
Mups - Magical, summon other slimes (not shown)
*I recommend saving the picture then zooming in a bit!

Apart from critiques, I want to pose a question I don't know how to answer: How details should sprites be? On the one hand, having less detail, so to speak, is more of a retro feel, which we are going for. On the other hand, does it show laziness? I've noticed while trying to view the animations that the death animations are too long, so far. And about 3 or 4 frames is all you need, or it looks like they linger or fade away, instead of a more visceral splash like death.

Thoughts? Thanks in advance!

Edited by jwgamedesign - 07 June 2013 at 9:06pm
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jwgamedesign
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Quote jwgamedesign Replybullet Posted: 07 June 2013 at 6:36pm
Don't be shy now. I see plenty of views. I'm sure someone has helpful information.
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Numberplay
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Quote Numberplay Replybullet Posted: 07 June 2013 at 6:51pm
The forum already have a zoom feature (click and shift click)

You should work with a lightsource in mind or else they look too simple.
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jalonso
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 07 June 2013 at 6:52pm
In the right environment and the right HUD/GUI these are terrific.
On their own they are simplistic and the colors are horrid...but that's their charm too. It all about what surrounds them.
You say you want a retro feel so go with it. Work on the tiles and other assets and then re-evaluate the game sprites. You can always up the pixelling at a later date.

E: No comments in Pixeljoint can be a good thing too. If there is nothing to crit why waste our pixelling time :p


Edited by jalonso - 07 June 2013 at 6:52pm
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jwgamedesign
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Quote jwgamedesign Replybullet Posted: 07 June 2013 at 9:05pm
Thanks for the responses and kind words guys.

The environment I have planned is a kind of de-saturated green sewer type environment. Even putting these little guys on a chromatic green color background makes them pop a lot better, so jalonso's comment makes a lot of sense. My partner, I think, is skeptical of their simple design, but I would like to see them in the right surrounding art like jalonso suggested.

Will post updates to slimes and environment in the coming day(s).
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jwgamedesign
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Quote jwgamedesign Replybullet Posted: 09 June 2013 at 7:45pm
Here's an update. We have some environment floor pieces, wall pieces, some updated Slimes and a friendly Knight who will be slashing his way through the Slimes eventually.




The environment extras, like pipes, grates and other stuff, are in the work. Comments welcome.

Edited by jwgamedesign - 09 June 2013 at 7:46pm
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Mabi
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Quote Mabi Replybullet Posted: 09 June 2013 at 9:53pm
Knight has a very zelda feel to it, I like it :)

I agree the slime has a strange choice of color and outline style. It looks cool but not very consistent with the knight render style

As of the animations, it might depens of how fluid your other animations are and if the game runs at 30 or 60 fps, but indeed you don't need more than 4 frames. Just like in japanese animation, sometime lacks of frame is what add movement.
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Quote Kurieta Replybullet Posted: 09 June 2013 at 10:05pm
Originally posted by Mabi

I agree the slime has a strange choice of color and outline style. It looks cool but not very consistent with the knight render style

I agree: the slime is very dark, while the knight is very bright. They actually seem like they belong in different games... Unless you were going for contrast. Either way, these look wonderful, good job!
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jwgamedesign
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Quote jwgamedesign Replybullet Posted: 10 June 2013 at 10:08am
On the outline thing, I'm going to have another pass at slime outline thing. The lighter color around their edges will be allocated to the top right for lighting I think.

Edit: Now I see what you're talking about with the outline style. I didn't realize that until now. I think I'll try to remove the outline on the Slimes.

Edited by jwgamedesign - 10 June 2013 at 10:23am
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Quote jwgamedesign Replybullet Posted: 10 June 2013 at 2:25pm
Small update to the slimes. How do you guys feel about the removed outline and attention to some lighting?


What do you recommend on having a shadow color? I'd like to add just a touch more of detail to the sprites in general. I'd like to keep the colors simple for my own sake. I was thinking, for a given color, to have something like:
-Base color
-Dark color
-Light color
-High light (sparingly used, not for all things)

It should also be noted these enemies will be a little bit transparent, so that may change stuff.

Edited by jwgamedesign - 10 June 2013 at 2:26pm
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jalonso
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 10 June 2013 at 2:56pm
oh, all their charm is gone :(
I think you should stay near the originals and match everything to them in style and look and feel.
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jwgamedesign
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Quote jwgamedesign Replybullet Posted: 10 June 2013 at 3:48pm
Ungh, are you kidding me? What about them looks worse?

Can you take one and modify it and show me an example or two? Would with or without outlines look best, assuming I got the other stuff right?

Edit: So they do look a little flat. I added some shadow on the bottom left and that helps them pop a bit more, but since they will be translucent, it isn't going to be right.

I probably should have mentioned that earlier. They will be translucent. Maybe the colors behind them will be what they need?

Edited by jwgamedesign - 11 June 2013 at 12:12pm
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jalonso
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 11 June 2013 at 6:05am
No kidding at all.
With the outer lines they are controlled and contained and have charm without them its just a cluster with dots on them and barely readable.
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Quote jwgamedesign Replybullet Posted: 11 June 2013 at 9:34am
And the rest of the unanswered questions?

Edit: Also, the Knight is a modified version from a classic Zelda sprite, being used as placeholder for now.

Edited by jwgamedesign - 11 June 2013 at 9:38am
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Quote skaytr Replybullet Posted: 11 June 2013 at 9:37am
Originally posted by jwgamedesign

And the rest of the unanswered questions?


This is a forum, not a chat page. Please be patient to await help :) It doesn't hurt to redefine your question, or research other areas while you are waiting for an update.

And personaly, i feel without an outline it looses allot of character. Most Cartoons/comics have outlines, the more kid friendly have fairly high contrast - It gives it a sort of comical feel to it. Without the highlight, it lacks detail (refraction/reflection), and looses its character. It also makes it look very flat, more like a green puddle than a slime. Expanding on the outline again, It kind of reminds me of Jello, which is pretty neat!

Edited by skaytr - 11 June 2013 at 9:39am
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jwgamedesign
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Quote jwgamedesign Replybullet Posted: 11 June 2013 at 12:14pm
Thanks for the feedback. It's just weird to me one would read over 5 or 6 questions and answer just one while saying nothing about the others.

Anyway, here's the slimes with some shadow on them. What do you think?
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jalonso
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 11 June 2013 at 12:53pm
You may have thought you asked several questions but I read only one general one and answered that one :/

Originally posted by jwgamedesign

Ungh, are you kidding me? What about them looks worse?

Answered the only question that pertained to me directly and the only question that to me, merited a reply right away...and the only question asked really.

Originally posted by jwgamedesign

Can you take one and modify it and show me an example or two?

You seem slightly hesitant to change anything and really I found nothing to edit as I liked the original sprites.

Originally posted by jwgamedesign

Would with or without outlines look best, assuming I got the other stuff right?

Redundant question answered by the first.

Originally posted by jwgamedesign

Edit: So they do look a little flat. I added some shadow on the bottom left and that helps them pop a bit more, but since they will be translucent, it isn't going to be right.

NO, because I felt they look best with the outlines as answered in the first question.

Originally posted by jwgamedesign

I probably should have mentioned that earlier. They will be translucent. Maybe the colors behind them will be what they need

I doubt this will happen and can see you eventually having to define the sprites especially if a semi transparency will be used.
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jwgamedesign
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Quote jwgamedesign Replybullet Posted: 11 June 2013 at 1:51pm
If I was hesitant to change things, I wouldn't have asked for you to take a sprite and modify it to understand what you mean. The other question was not redundant. If the lines were gone and the other stuff (should have been more specific, but what I meant was everything else around the sprite such as players, environment, or maybe even movement) would it be OK? You did not answer that. After all you said it's about what surrounds them, and if nothing has lines but the slimes won't they look out of place?

:|

Maybe those questions are the same in your mind, but they are not in mine. If a 5 year old asked what 2+2 was and then asked what 1+3 was, you wouldn't keep quiet, you would explain they are the same answer.

Now then, what do you think of the previous picture I put up there, jalonso? I've learned that not having the outline means more room to work with (in general, not so important with these slimes, but as you can see with the knight there isn't a lot of real estate), so I'd like to find that 'charm' again without the lines if possible.

Edited by jwgamedesign - 11 June 2013 at 1:51pm
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Quote RileyFiery Replybullet Posted: 12 June 2013 at 6:26am
Is this meant for a zelda-perspective game?To be honest, I like the earlier version with the line more. I'm a bit biased on that though since I do it a lot for slimes. Example

Here's my attempt at an edit. I don't know what you're going for really, so I just played around.

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jwgamedesign
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Quote jwgamedesign Replybullet Posted: 12 June 2013 at 8:13am
Thanks for that. I needed to see how you did that dark color within the slime, that's useful. The slimes will be underground in a dark area, so that particular slime is bright. It does look good though.

Our players will be 16x16, and having an outline takes up a lot of room, so that's a concern of mine.
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