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dragonrc
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Topic: My samurai/knight
    Posted: 13 November 2006 at 5:00am
my samurai/knight
 
I posted it here because I want to improve it, and i would like to animate it.
 
so, post your oppinion: should i improve it? what should i improve?
 
 


Edited by dragonrc - 13 November 2006 at 5:37am
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 13 November 2006 at 7:12am
ok, this is the progress of the animation.
I want him to turn the other way slashing with his sword. I know I still need to add...uh.. the WOOOSHHH thing(the wind), but Ill do that at the and


Edited by dragonrc - 13 November 2006 at 7:29am
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Quote SeanGraal Replybullet Posted: 13 November 2006 at 7:36am
the shading and details are pretty nice...what bothers me is the animation. no1 really slashes like that. (well maybe a robot, if you give it a sword)
 try and find some references to slashing and slashing stances...


Edited by SeanGraal - 13 November 2006 at 7:36am
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Quote EyeCraft Replybullet Posted: 13 November 2006 at 9:09am
Hello. Please remove the link to imageshack from the images.

I'm very tired right now, so I'll just do some quick critique on the animation:

-his feet shouldnt slide along the ground like that, they should pretty much be stationary, except for a possible twisting of the ankles.
-his arm should bend

argh...if i wasnt so tired I'd do a quick example for you...until then I'll reuse the one I did earlier for someone else;



You need a proper angle of motion and a follow through. Plan the animation out, determine the key frames of the action and go from there. Do the action yourself infront of a mirror and freeze yourself at certain stages to get a good idea of what happens, etc.


Edited by EyeCraft - 13 November 2006 at 9:09am
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dragonrc
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 13 November 2006 at 9:09am
it will be something like this, attack an enemy from behind
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 13 November 2006 at 11:08am
this is how its gonna be. Its not finished, if you look closely the arm suddenly appears when it turns I just wanted to show you how the animation will turn out 
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 13 November 2006 at 11:32am
finished
 
it didnt turn out as i had hoped though
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Quote Pieface Replybullet Posted: 13 November 2006 at 1:58pm
Add some trail marks on the sword when its moving, and add a few framses more
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Quote Souly Replybullet Posted: 13 November 2006 at 2:29pm
It looks like a pansy hit.
I mean honestly it looks like he's dubbing someone a knight, not disemboweling their head.

Also, don't triple post.
If you have anything new to add just use the edit button and edit your old post.

As well, you have to remove the links to imageshack.
This forum has a click zoom option, and we can't zoom in when it is a link.


Edited by Souly - 13 November 2006 at 2:30pm

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Quote EyeCraft Replybullet Posted: 13 November 2006 at 9:58pm
Like I said before, his feet shouldn't slide over the ground like that, it doesn't make sense. You've approached the motion far too linearly. You have to think about how much time each part of the motion takes and assign numbers of frames accordingly.
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 14 November 2006 at 5:41am
Thanx for all the replies.
 
I have some questions,
 
well i cant use imageshack, so what else? maby you could post a link
 
Well i tried a couple of things with the feet, but they all turned out like @#@#$. Hes turning around so his feet should move, right?
 
''You've approached the motion far too linearly. You have to think about how much time each part of the motion takes and assign numbers of frames accordingly''
hmm, what do you mean with that? I can speak english but sometimes i need some help(Babelfish doesnt give a good translation)
 
 
Well like i said the whole animation didn't turn out that well, now its more like turning around that slashing...


Edited by dragonrc - 14 November 2006 at 5:44am
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Quote EyeCraft Replybullet Posted: 14 November 2006 at 5:53am
Ummm...ok stand up and turn around 180 degrees. Did your feet slide magically over the ground? Unless you are standing on ice or are floating in space, there's actually going to be  muscular movement that you will do.

Observe doing the motion. Replicate it in the animation.

When you upload something on imageshack it spits a bunch of URLs at you. You want to copy the direct link to image url. Then using the image button on this website (picture of tree) you paste in the url and presto, image is in your post and people can zoom it.


Edited by EyeCraft - 14 November 2006 at 5:54am
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dragonrc
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 14 November 2006 at 7:15am
Thanx for the tip about posting the image
In the meantime i made a preview of casting a magic spell.
Ill try to make it into a fire spell.
 
Ill also try to edit my old animation again.
 
Please post of what you think about this^^^^
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Quote EyeCraft Replybullet Posted: 14 November 2006 at 8:56am
The raising of the sword looks good. I think there should be some conveyence of energy or magic, however, such as his hair moving or floating.

His arm appears to shorten as he raises the sword, you should make sure its always the same apparent length.
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 14 November 2006 at 11:52pm
Thanks for the tip of moving hairill use that
 
http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/9041/bendbz7.png
this explains why the arms appear shorter
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Quote EyeCraft Replybullet Posted: 15 November 2006 at 2:15am
I'm well aware of how the arm should bend. But thats not how it looks in the animation. His arms should be further outwards from his body, at the moment they seem to shrink in towards his torso in a noodly fashion. Try to put your arms in the same position the character has them...yours will stick out much further.

Edited by EyeCraft - 15 November 2006 at 2:15am
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 15 November 2006 at 6:05am
 
maby this improves it
 
 
here is a part of the magic spell i was planning to make
I was supprised of the result, I thought it would turn out very bad.
I dont know what but something botheres me about it though.... something doesnt feel right, or is it just me?
post your oppinion about it
 
edit:
I must be crazy to think i can animate this but ill try
 
 


Edited by dragonrc - 15 November 2006 at 6:49am
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Aleiav
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Quote Aleiav Replybullet Posted: 15 November 2006 at 6:18pm
If you're going to animate it, I don't think dithering is the right way to go. Otherwise, that animation would take AGES. :O

I would look at Blueberry_Pie's signature which, last I checked, had a pretty awesome explosion animation in it. Granted, this is a magical spell, but I think the colors and transitions would be beneficial to look at.
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Quote EyeCraft Replybullet Posted: 16 November 2006 at 1:35am
The frame is unnecessarily detailed for an animation like this. Each frame will only be visible for like 1/10th of a second, you only need them to be really basic. Don't get bogged down on details so early, work on the animation as a whole, and then refine its detail until you are happy with it.
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 16 November 2006 at 5:59am
 
here it is
 
Well, i know that the animation will be hard, but ill try.


Edited by dragonrc - 16 November 2006 at 6:01am
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Quote EyeCraft Replybullet Posted: 16 November 2006 at 6:33am
Ok, I'm done with this, there's basically no point telling you anything because either you lack the basic ability to listen to people, or you just don't regard anything I have to say to have any worth.

Bye.
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 16 November 2006 at 8:03am
Im sorry to hear that
I listen to all replies, this doesn't say ill do something with all of them. I used some of your tips, but if I want to work very long at an animation because it is detailed doenst say I dont listen to your replies.
 

“Thanks for the tip of moving hair”

“Thanx for the tip about posting the image”

 
I use things you say that i think that will improve the image.


Edited by dragonrc - 16 November 2006 at 8:38am
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Quote Souly Replybullet Posted: 16 November 2006 at 11:24am
But see, that's where you're going in the wrong direction.
Just because it's what you want it to look like doesn't make it visually attractive to anyone else.

We point out what is wrong with it and what needs to be done with it.
If you choose not to take our advice then you're just going to end up making a sh*tty piece that looks like no effort was put into it.

We give you advice for a reason.
I expect you to listen to them and take them into consideration.
No one likes to be ignored, especially when they tell you perfectly what is wrong with it.

What's the reason for asking for help when you're barely going to use it?

I am the jesus of PJ.
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Quote Larwick Replybullet Posted: 16 November 2006 at 11:50am

Calm down people.

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Quote PixelSnader Replybullet Posted: 16 November 2006 at 6:13pm

not using comments could be a stylistic choice sometimes, i dont incorporate everything everyone says either. however i do use C&C that help me get the images mesage across, making it clearer etc.

in this case, tis about making things clear.
the red stuff is supposed to be a fire spell i suppose? the colours tell me so, the spiky-ish stuff kinda tells me so, but the shading and shapes look like a plant.
 
i'll allso say this. dithers are no use. they make the thing look very gritty, and fire has a very smooth texture (yes it has a texture. sorta =P)
and the flames around it to not really immerse the shape inside the wayyou made them, they appear to be only behind the main spell

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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 16 November 2006 at 9:33pm
problem 1: Well, when I removed the dithers some parts looks kind of wierd, like in the middle, or should i just dither less?
 the 2 circulating blasts dont look bad wo shading but the fireball does, should i only dither the fireball?
And the shape, its supposed to be a fire ball where 2 blasts of flames come out and circulate to the top.
problem 2: I agree that it looks like most of the flames go only behind it, I actually made it so some go behind and some to the front, but when i didnt had the lines between the fireball and the spikes, it looked really bad. I now drew some lines somewhat lighter but it still looks if most ofthem go behind it, but sometimes it looked as if they were attached to the main fire. I dont really know how to solve this problem
I also think that the top left part is ugly
 


Edited by dragonrc - 16 November 2006 at 9:42pm
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Quote PixelSnader Replybullet Posted: 17 November 2006 at 10:30am
i think you are trying to define every fire particle too much, fire is pretty fluid stuff, there actyally  arent all that much different flames, they blend together
 
i made a couple of keyframes thet could help you out, as well as a bit more fleshed out ''final'' image
i hope this gives you some ideas
 
allso: note how little red/ orange i use compared to yellow and white, this makes it a brighter (hotter/stronger) flame

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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 17 November 2006 at 10:40pm
Wow, that looks fantastic!
I will certainly change my thing after i get home today.
things ill change:
-make it lighter
-only use spikes in the fireball
-use spikes in the front, not only to the sides
 
Thanks, this really helps me out 
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Quote PixelSnader Replybullet Posted: 18 November 2006 at 4:56am
dude. try NOT to see it as spikes. they are NOT solid and should NOT be treated as such

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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 18 November 2006 at 6:14am
sorry, but whats it called, flames?
 
anyway, I did a quick edit to give an idea of how its gonna look, i only edited the bottom.
When i was working on it it turned out better and better, but the flames in the middle kind of ruind it, any idea what im doing wrong?
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Quote ceddo Replybullet Posted: 18 November 2006 at 6:15am
Looks awesome snader!
@dragon: I don't think you need 6 colors for the fire. For an animation, I think 3 or 4 would suffice... 6 is still too much work, and it ends up being like you want to fit each color in...
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Quote Larwick Replybullet Posted: 18 November 2006 at 6:48am
Originally posted by dragonrc

any idea what im doing wrong?
 
Originally posted by snader

i think you are trying to define every fire particle too much, fire is pretty fluid stuff, there actyally  arent all that much different flames, they blend together
 
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 18 November 2006 at 10:20am
=>
 
your right!  it looks better now doesnt it?
Tomorrow ill work on the rest
Ill try to use less colours, but I think thats gonna be hard because each colour has an own purpuse
 
edit:
removed 2 colours:
1 turned into a lighter colour(you can see it at the bottom of the fireball)
and there was 1 colour that only had 10 pixels (they were outlines that hadnt been changed after the previous edits)


Edited by dragonrc - 18 November 2006 at 10:29am
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Quote Aleiav Replybullet Posted: 18 November 2006 at 3:21pm
I think it's less defined than before, but still rigid because they're pointy. I'd look at snader's edit again or google some pictures of fire.
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Quote Pixel_Outlaw Replybullet Posted: 18 November 2006 at 3:31pm
Try making the central overlapping parts cross at a more natural angle, The 45 degree thing isn't realy working. Looks like something from an older arcade game very cool.
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 19 November 2006 at 12:36am
Aleiav: Ill try to make them less spikey, also ill make some loose flames:
 
Pixel_Outlaw: what exacly do you mean? Should make the flames at the sides go more up?
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 19 November 2006 at 6:43am
=>
update, after i added the loose flames i started to make the flames less pointy. This didn't turn out that well so i began experimenting with other things, i softened the lines  and i think it looks much better now.
Post ur oppinion


Edited by dragonrc - 19 November 2006 at 6:59am
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Quote ceddo Replybullet Posted: 19 November 2006 at 7:56am
I say you should reduce the color count even more. Sorry, this is just a real quick color replacement, and though it looks like ****...

... you don't need so many colors! It can actually ruin the aspect of your flames. In that picture, there are only 3 colors + transparency. You may have to adapt your image so that it looks better, such as removing the dither, but you'll end up making things much faster, and that look much nicer.

Edited by ceddo - 19 November 2006 at 8:02am
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 19 November 2006 at 8:53am
ok, ill try to remove some extra colours.
Maby you were looking at the whole image, but i only remade the ball of fire and it doenst have any dithering anymore. The rest of the spell will be remade later.
 
edit:
removed 1 colour, the red outline now is gone.
The image looks better without the red outlines.
I tried to remove some more colours but that would change the picture dramaticly, in a bad way...
 
I see what you want to show me with your image, but that will change the image very much, I don't say i dont like it, its style is used in many games where it usually looks very good. But the game i'm spriting for doesn't have that kind of style, if I would remove more colours so it looks like your example it would turn out bad compared with the other sprites.
The game im spriting for looks somewhat like ff tactics, try to think your image in that game, it wouldnt look good.(not that mine would look good, but hey, thats why im here in the WIP forum)
 
The problem usually is that you see the image as a pixel art, that way you will look different to it then when its a sprite for a game.
That usually is my problem, Im too much concetrating on making it look perfect as a piece rather then making it fit into a game
 


Edited by dragonrc - 19 November 2006 at 9:17am
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Quote Larwick Replybullet Posted: 19 November 2006 at 11:24am
Originally posted by snader

i think you are trying to define every fire particle too much, fire is pretty fluid stuff, there actyally  arent all that much different flames, they blend together
 
i made a couple of keyframes thet could help you out, as well as a bit more fleshed out ''final'' image
i hope this gives you some ideas
 
allso: note how little red/ orange i use compared to yellow and white, this makes it a brighter (hotter/stronger) flame
 
I suggest you read this again, it should really help you, but you're not picking up on it all too well. You need higher contrast, less individual spikes with pillow shading (which makes it look like one of those glowing lamps). Think of it more like a gas or liquid, rather than a solid form. The light eminates from the centre of the flame, and dissapates near the edges and top.
 
If you're planning on animating this, i would strongly suggest doing a draft animation with a colour or two first, or you'll find it hell later.
 
One thing which should help you the most would be references of flames. Google images should find some quite easily (although make sure they're real life references).
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 20 November 2006 at 9:05am
Ok, ill work on it tomorrow and ill go through all the steps again
 
-ill remove more flames (especially at the top, ill make the bottom ones bigger)
-Question, what is pillow shading? Iv seen the term often but it seems it has more meanings
-draft animation, this means very basic at first and make it look good in the end right?
 
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 20 November 2006 at 12:19pm

Update:

I worked a little bit on the points you noticed, i will certainly work on them more
 
:
 
I think its better now but it looks less wild.
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Quote Souly Replybullet Posted: 20 November 2006 at 12:35pm
Seem you make it so each point of the fire is single.
Which is not the case with fire.
It doesn't point up like a spike either.

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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 21 November 2006 at 4:59am
maby his solves the problem.
But when you want the fire to be one youll have to use more flames....
but that will send you to a problem discussed above
But i think it looks better then the old one, but there are many flames now....
 
 < this is an older version of the fire. There was said it had too many flames, then i made the one above. But it looked ununited, thats why i made the 2nd one on the image above. It looks more united but..... 


Edited by dragonrc - 21 November 2006 at 5:00am
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Quote scottfro Replybullet Posted: 21 November 2006 at 7:10am
http://www.sbnbs.com/gallery/classics/Fireball.jpg

Edited by scottfro - 21 November 2006 at 7:09am
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 21 November 2006 at 8:49am

Woah, that gav me some inspiration

im going to do it all over

i made a sketch of how it going to look:

before im going to colour it, please tell me if the sketch needs changes
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Quote Larwick Replybullet Posted: 21 November 2006 at 12:37pm
That wasn't exactly the best reference.. but it seems it's inspired you into a good direction.
 
At the moment the sense of scale seems quite off. This is meant to relate to the little sprite made before, yes?
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Quote dragonrc Replybullet Posted: 21 November 2006 at 11:29pm
Yeah, ill try to fix it, i am quite bussy the next 2 days so i think the update will come somewhat later
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