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JJ_Maxx
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Quote JJ_Maxx Replybullet Topic: Impossible Waterfall ISO
    Posted: 11 December 2007 at 8:49pm
I was working on this today, just got done hashing out the general design.

Would like some feedback/crits before any true detail goes into it.



This is the general idea so far.

~ JJ


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greenraven
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Quote greenraven Replybullet Posted: 11 December 2007 at 8:55pm
I like it. 

This is an optical illusion, most c&c is based on 'realism', so I doubt you're going to get a lot of c&c.

Is it going to be animated once finished?
"pwnage comes with patience, practice and planning." ~ Jalonso   
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Metaru
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Quote Metaru Replybullet Posted: 11 December 2007 at 9:00pm
so, i assume you're using the escher's optical effect as a base, and you're going to focus more on the details of it, aren't you? if that's the case, lets see what you could do.
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JJ_Maxx
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Quote JJ_Maxx Replybullet Posted: 11 December 2007 at 9:20pm
Originally posted by Metaru

so, i assume you're using the escher's optical effect as a base, and you're going to focus more on the details of it, aren't you? if that's the case, lets see what you could do.


Yes, the inspiration is Escher, but all my angles are equal where his were slightly different. As soon as I lay out the basic design, I will brick out the walls and have them 'step' down all the way to the top, making the illusion even stronger. But right now all the angles and depths/widths are all flotsam and jetsam, no real rhyme or reason to them. Will be tweaking tomorrow.

~ JJ
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zi-double
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Quote zi-double Replybullet Posted: 12 December 2007 at 12:23am
white line in the right bottom /from water/ isn't right ...
second column from left to right isn't right ...


Edited by zi-double - 12 December 2007 at 12:23am
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JJ_Maxx
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Quote JJ_Maxx Replybullet Posted: 12 December 2007 at 8:07pm
Update!

Okay, so I removed the pillars because I realized they were a part of the illusion, but not as important as the aqueduct itself and the 'step-down' look to it. It needs to look perfectly normal if you cover up the left hand side of it.

Anyways here's the update:



I've been staring at this thing for hours, please tell me how the illusion comes off to fresh eyes.

~ JJ
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T-boy
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Quote T-boy Replybullet Posted: 12 December 2007 at 11:37pm

the illusion in ur waterfall is showin really strong

i keep starin at it when the water cycles again


Edited by T-boy - 12 December 2007 at 11:37pm
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leel
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Quote leel Replybullet Posted: 13 December 2007 at 8:03am
Yeah I see the illusion but the water texture bothers me.  It's so common that people do this and I don't really get it - the way it looks now, you get the feeling that a water is a solid sheet of blue with random horizontal (!) parts sparking.

I looked up waterfalls on google and it supports my logic - the lighter striped should indeed be vertical.


This one sort of looks like what you've got there, except the dark part isn't the blue water  - it's the rough rocks that the water is falling on.

Since there's no rough rocks underneath YOUR water,  I think you should consider the smoother vertical stripes instead
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Hapiel
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Quote Hapiel Replybullet Posted: 13 December 2007 at 8:21am
Quick edit.. your waterfall is awesome btw, mine is worse..

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JJ_Maxx
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Quote JJ_Maxx Replybullet Posted: 13 December 2007 at 9:22am
Originally posted by leel

Yeah I see the illusion but the water texture bothers me.  It's so common that people do this and I don't really get it - the way it looks now, you get the feeling that a water is a solid sheet of blue with random horizontal (!) parts sparking.

I looked up waterfalls on google and it supports my logic - the lighter striped should indeed be vertical.


This one sort of looks like what you've got there, except the dark part isn't the blue water  - it's the rough rocks that the water is falling on.

Since there's no rough rocks underneath YOUR water,  I think you should consider the smoother vertical stripes instead


Thanks for the references. The waterfall texture that's there now is just a placeholder. I didn't put nuch effort into it yet. Just looked better than solid blue.

I was planning pillar placement and realized I need some more space on the edges. So I widened it a bit and added some 'flow' effects where the steps are, like lollige pointed out.



I think I will work on some pillars next.

~ MC
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Fuzzyleaves
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Quote Fuzzyleaves Replybullet Posted: 13 December 2007 at 12:18pm
my try... just thought of making the white or gray a blue. (also make it not look like a pattern) 
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Doomcreator0
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Quote Doomcreator0 Replybullet Posted: 13 December 2007 at 1:23pm
Great Idea, Though I think that you should give it a more waterfall feel rather than straight lines.

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Kfuchoin
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Quote Kfuchoin Replybullet Posted: 13 December 2007 at 2:51pm

Hello JJ.

I'm a really fan of Escher and i belive that pialr are fundamental on this, the waterfall does not makes sense to me.. the angle is wrong looks like it twist, i'll make an edit based on morgan edit.

i know that escher bases on irreality and stuff but on the actaul piece that he amde the waterfall doesn't twist. so check this, also the black lines that defines teh waterfall doesn't look good =/
 
 
a suggestion could be shrotening the upper part of the waterfall so the waterfall when it falls reaches teh center of the lower part and not a corner.
 
great work so far. i'm hoping to see more from this.
 
Grettings
Kfuchoin.
 
may the pixels be with you..
~Kfuchoin
eMo

looking for people for an RPG info: http://www.pixeljoint.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4903
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volcom
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Quote volcom Replybullet Posted: 13 December 2007 at 2:57pm
awesome, love the optical illusion idea...you should add more little currents to the other water movements also. Great work
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leel
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Quote leel Replybullet Posted: 13 December 2007 at 2:59pm
Kfu: The waterfall twisting is a big part of the illusion...

Edited by leel - 13 December 2007 at 2:59pm
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Monkey 'o Doom
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Quote Monkey 'o Doom Replybullet Posted: 13 December 2007 at 3:57pm
But taking into account JJ Maxx's design in whole, we see that his approach is more aesthetically pleasing and makes more sense at first glance than Kfu's edit.

Edited by Monkey 'o Doom - 13 December 2007 at 3:59pm

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JJ_Maxx
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Quote JJ_Maxx Replybullet Posted: 13 December 2007 at 5:01pm
Well, keep in mind that Escher's work is the inspiration for the peice, and isn't meant to be exact. I wanted to add my own twist to it. (No pun intended.)

But before I saw the reply I tried extending and turning to see how it would look and I think I like it better twisting then coming down the same way as the bottom level. It 'dampens' the illusion with it like this I think.



~ JJ
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leel
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Quote leel Replybullet Posted: 13 December 2007 at 5:26pm
heh I agree, it doesn't have to be exactly to the man's specifications.    It does look cooler this way imo - it helps the illusion.  
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Doomcreator0
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Quote Doomcreator0 Replybullet Posted: 13 December 2007 at 5:28pm

I like what you did, although you should connect some more because part of it looks like a slope. So it kills part of the illusion.

It's the gap right next to the waterfall.

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zi-double
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Quote zi-double Replybullet Posted: 14 December 2007 at 12:45am
I hope now you will understand where your water must fail


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Acherhar
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Quote Acherhar Replybullet Posted: 14 December 2007 at 5:42am
Or maybe you could keep the twisted look like this:
 
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Fuzzyleaves
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Quote Fuzzyleaves Replybullet Posted: 14 December 2007 at 10:23am
If you want it to look like the masters:

Look at the shape, compared to his, you have 2 extra corners. It makes it look good, but i can change the position of the waterfall and where it lands.

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JJ_Maxx
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Quote JJ_Maxx Replybullet Posted: 14 December 2007 at 11:34am
The trouble is that eschers angles are quite small, whereas mine have to be larger. I could do the same setup but it would have to be bigger.
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leel
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Quote leel Replybullet Posted: 14 December 2007 at 12:31pm
I say do what you want - if you just pixelize escher's piece to the last detail that'd be dull and just.. whatever.    

Though I agree - with the bend in the top of the waterfall you should bend the bottom as well.  I think acher's edit looks cool :D
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Hapiel
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Quote Hapiel Replybullet Posted: 14 December 2007 at 1:07pm
Its all about if you want to match Echer or not.

You better dont, and create your own, new art, instead of a replication of Eshers waterfall.
I liked the twisted waterfall. Bring it back, bring more of yourself in, get inspired by Esher, but as you said yourself too, dont duplicate it.
Thats the best thing I think.
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Wattsie1993
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Quote Wattsie1993 Replybullet Posted: 15 December 2007 at 4:06am
I ask, could i do a different part of the image?
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JJ_Maxx
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Quote JJ_Maxx Replybullet Posted: 15 December 2007 at 5:49pm
Originally posted by Wattsie1993

I ask, could i do a different part of the image?


Knock yourself out. Unfortunately, the odds of me finishing this sometime before 2011 is slim to none. I've just always wanted to see some illusions in pixel work. I've done the impossible triangle before but this is the biggest piece I've ever done.

~ JJ
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