Cliff/Grassland Tileset WIP
Printed From: Pixel Joint
Category: Pixel Art
Forum Name: WIP (Work In Progress)
Forum Discription: Get crits and comments on your pixel WIPs and other art too!
URL: https://pixeljoint.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=20026
Printed Date: 09 September 2025 at 5:44pm
Topic: Cliff/Grassland Tileset WIP
Posted By: Turon
Subject: Cliff/Grassland Tileset WIP
Date Posted: 28 October 2014 at 11:01am
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So I made a new tileset and its now 16-16 pixels high and wide. The game I'm making will use the Sega Genesis Color Palette with 32 colors on screen at a time. I can see that my tileset isn't perfect but I think its the best tileset I've made so far. I think the structure of the set could be more efficient.  Note: The grass tops and the rough edges are treated as seperate objects in the game engine I have on "Game Editor". Latest Incarnation:  //www.pinterest.com/pin/create/extension/ - //www.pinterest.com/pin/create/extension/ - |
Replies:
Posted By: DrTripwire
Date Posted: 28 October 2014 at 9:20pm
| I love the texture, but I think the orange might be a little too harsh on the eyes. Could be just me, though. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 29 October 2014 at 1:10am
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Okay it looks very Orange but it doesn't look like Lava does it?
How's the grass? Cause it was quite a struggle getting grass that would look good with the ground. I really need to relook the tile structures, any suggestions? Does this look better than my previous attemp http://www.pixeljoint.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=19721&KW= - Here ? |
Posted By: DrTripwire
Date Posted: 29 October 2014 at 6:12am
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It could look like lava, but, since there's the grass, I don't think anyone will think so.
I like the grass! I can't help you with tile structures, I'm sorry. D: Nice improvement |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 30 October 2014 at 1:47am
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Does anyone here know about tiles?
And do you think a more creamy colored rock would do better than orange? |
Posted By: DwindlingDwarf
Date Posted: 31 October 2014 at 3:13pm
| I think classic dirt should be more brown (less saturated too), maybe a hint of yellowy brown as highlights? Try it and I'll be happy to see what progress you make with this game :D |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 01 November 2014 at 9:35am
| I think I have something that could work but it'll need a few mores tests. And as for the game it'll be a Metrtoidvanian Platformer/ Action RPG it'll have a flip mechanic between sidescrolling and top-down perspective.So far though this tileset is the most evident piece of progress. |
Posted By: RebeaLeion
Date Posted: 01 November 2014 at 10:05am
I remade it a bit. I kept your colours on the first and made change on the second attempt.
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Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 02 November 2014 at 6:04am
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Has anyone played Trip World? well... my tile were inisualy based on those from trip wold but I realize I actually wanted tiles with rough edges liken to cave story and made the following alterations. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 03 November 2014 at 4:55am
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Well anyway here it its! its much the same really just with some color alterations, I have made my own analysis but I'll only mention it after you reply, any thoughts?  |
Posted By: jalonso
Date Posted: 03 November 2014 at 5:20am
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I find the rocks/ground far too busy.
Simplifying those tiles and adding a bit of depth shadowing should help. ------------- |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 03 November 2014 at 6:22am
| Yes I was thinking that the rock might be a bit busy... but what's depth shadowing? |
Posted By: jalonso
Date Posted: 03 November 2014 at 6:30am
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Adding a bit of ground shadow below the grass with whatever dark colors you use on the rocks/ground so it both adds depths and defines the playable platforms.
Not the best example but this should give you an idea. http://www.pixeljoint.com/pixelart/28949.htm - http://www.pixeljoint.com/pixelart/28949.htm ------------- |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 03 November 2014 at 8:05am
| Is RebeaLeion's edit closer to the ideal? |
Posted By: jalonso
Date Posted: 03 November 2014 at 8:53am
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I dunno about 'ideal' but RebeaLeion's edit is just what I mentioned. Notice how it reads much better and is more defined whereas your is more of a pixel pudding. ------------- |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 04 November 2014 at 5:41am
Okay well I got rid of 4 unnecessary tiles and redid 2, I believe I may have added more form to the ground but I don't know about shadowing... Thoughts?  |
Posted By: jalonso
Date Posted: 04 November 2014 at 6:33am
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This just shows the defining shadow under the grass a bit exaggerated. The grass looks fine but the rocks are just too busy and do not read as rocks. I would simplify that area.  ------------- |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 04 November 2014 at 6:40am
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Do you think what I put out just now is a improvement of not really? also another thing is that the ground is actually supposed to be a cliff. I think I'm happier with what I go just now, but I'll see if I can do the shading part. |
Posted By: jalonso
Date Posted: 04 November 2014 at 6:57am
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Well, if you're happy with it as it is then its case closed. To me its not an improvement because I don't 'see' what you want me to see. Creating any art should be what you want it to be because art is subjective but, at some point all artists have to take the viewer into account because art is a form of communication and communication is a two way street. ------------- |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 04 November 2014 at 8:36am
| well I have less tiles and less tiles are easier to regulate right? and I plan to slope tiles too. I'm going to make the rock look right first, but when you said it didn't look like rock were you pointing at a specific area or the whole thing? |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 04 November 2014 at 11:07pm
| RebeiLeion@, when you did your edit were you thinking of a cliff or the ground in a terrarium through glass? |
Posted By: RebeaLeion
Date Posted: 05 November 2014 at 1:32am
| Nah, I just tried to remake it. I am novice so it was more for a practice.... I tried to show a readability. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 05 November 2014 at 4:07am
Jalonso@, Do these tiles look like rock? |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 06 November 2014 at 2:23am
| Well I'm gonna redo some of the rock to be more like the two I just showed. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 09 November 2014 at 10:34am
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This is what I got now, Its not the final product but I hope its a improvement does it look like rock? I do plan on altering the colors on a later date.  |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 10 November 2014 at 8:16am
| Does it look like rock? |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 10 November 2014 at 8:19am
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On their own, the rock tiles do not look like rock, no. They look vaguely like dirt only because of the green on top. The orange colour doesn't help. Look at the shapes you're defining. They're highly irregular, stretched in various ways, with long branches(!). Rocks and dirt on cliff faces do not tend to look like that, so those shapes do not read as rocks/dirt. In addition, all of your shapes are defined effectively as lineart - dark lines separating (somewhat pillow-shaded?) areas of light. Whether you want rocks or layers of dirt, you can't define them with just outlines, you'll need to think about their forms and how those forms are affected by light. Try separating your various rocks/segments by juxtaposing highlights with shadows, instead of putting a dark outline on everything. You haven't been clear about what you're trying to draw here, which isn't helping people give you advice. Is it loose dirt? Compacted dirt in layers? Classic game-style rocks? A more specific sort of rock? You mentioned Tripworld, but that has cliffs made mostly of large boulders, very different from what you've made here. I think you should focus on just pixelling a cliff face that looks good to you, and split it up into tiles later. I fear that by focusing on the tiling aspects, you're not letting yourself focus on the overall appearance. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 10 November 2014 at 8:26am
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maybe the irregular apearence of the tiles is a reflection of my own confusion. I really don't know what to do now... what does juxtaposing the rock forms mean? |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 10 November 2014 at 9:00am
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"Juxtaposing" means to position things next to each other in a way that provides contrast. By "forms", I mean the implied 3D form (versus flat, 2D shape) of the rocks. Shapes are what you're making because you're working in 2D, but you can create (imply) forms by careful use of light and shadow. For example, check out http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/1101419084293861728/9ED30CE67C10E21BECBE60BBA060B0034972CEF5/ - this Frogatto screenshot . Most of the rocks are not outlined, yet you can still see individual rocks. This is because the lightest parts (highlights) are positioned next to darker parts of other rocks. Contrast works even better than lines at separating forms and planes. Juxtaposing highlights and shadows (placing them next to each other) will allow you to create separations between individual rocks without needing to use outlines. It does look like you're not sure of what you want, and that's probably why you're struggling so much with these tiles. Let's start with the basics: What is this tileset for? Is it for a game you're making, or just for practice, or something else? Is it meant to fit in with any existing assets? It's always difficult to make assets without a clear idea of the wider picture, so even if you're not making a full game, it might help to think about what sort of world these tiles are meant to be a part of. For example, if the game/world/whatever takes place in the wild west, you'd have different kinds of cliffs than you would if it took place on a planet where everything is made of bubbles. |
Posted By: StoneStephenT
Date Posted: 10 November 2014 at 9:01am
Your biggest problem with your rock tiles is the lack of contrast between the rocks supposedly jutting out from the earth and the earth itself. This image from PJ user Doppleganger should show you what I mean. Look at the cliff walls at both the near-top of the image and in the water area. You can determine a clear light source from the shading, make out individual rocks, and get a sense of depth as a result. For an example closer to what you're trying to build, take a look at this image from PJ user Cage_AK:  Again: clear light source, individual rocks, implied depth as a result. The rocks in your tiles have both an ill-defined light source and little-to-no "individuality". Your tiles appear to be more mud than rock. Tighten up the shapes of the rocks and contrast them more with the earth/dirt from which they jut out. If it gets tough, remember that you're going to get better by perservering and working through it. You can make this better, even if you don't think you can at first. And people here are willing to help if you really need it.  |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 10 November 2014 at 12:37pm
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So yu guys say that you need more background to figure out what I'm
trying to do? I get the feeling this topic will span multiple pages. You see in the world I'm trying to portray has a rainforest at the base but steep mountains rise above the forest and floating islands at the same level as the mountain tops, and the islands and mountain tops are covered with shrubby terrain and giant western pasqueflowers. I came across the theme after a huge brain storm and I drew this picture with markers, I except that it isn't pixel-art but I just feel I have to show you all. Because it isn't pixel art I have provided a link to the image: http://s1373.photobucket.com/component/Download-File?file=%2Falbums%2Fag385%2FTurokei%2FExample_zps8f25d54a.png - http://s1373.photobucket.com/component/Download-File?file=%2Falbums%2Fag385%2FTurokei%2FExample_zps8f25d54a.png |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 10 November 2014 at 2:58pm
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You didn't really think you could just get a quick answer and be done right away, did you? xP The part you're tiling right now, it's meant to be a floating island, right? Is the island meant to have very different terrain from the mountains and rainforests below it, or is it meant to look like it broke off/flew up from the ground? In other words, how similar is the ground on it to that of the land below? You can actually suggest how the islands formed through how you texture their ground. For example, if you make the tiles convey a ripped and twisted pattern, it'll look like the islands were wrenched off the earth relatively recently (geologically - could still be millions of years!). If they look very smooth and have different colours from the land below, they'll look like they floated in from somewhere else and have been floating for eons... there are many possibilities. Thinking of it might help you come up with an appropriate visual to aim for. Here are some images of similar terrain for reference and inspiration (these are all places where mountains and tropical rainforests are next to each other): http://nipunscorp.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/Gros-Piton.jpg - St. Lucia , http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-sAqi27RmGUE/UdsmPWH1rLI/AAAAAAAABqw/7pgzBaQ5TVM/s640/DSC03406.JPG - Vietnam , http://www.traveladventures.org/countries/vietnam/images/halong-bay03.jpg - more Vietnam . Different mountains have different textures and colours. You don't have to know all about geology to draw them, but here are a few pointers: - Rainforests don't grow on mountains. Instead, they'll grow in lower-lying areas where soil can accumulate. It looks like you already know this, but I wanted to point it out because of one thing: the soil where the forest grows will be much darker than the soil and rocks up in the mountains. This is because that fertile rainforest soil is made mostly of decomposed plant material, not parts of the surrounding rocks. - Mountains are not piles of rocks. They are uplifted and partially eroded segments of what was once bedrock, or they are cooled lava flows, or a combination of the two. They are consolidated masses of soil or rock, not piles of loose rock. Mountains can have piles of rocks on and around them though, since they erode over time. What this means to you is that when you make your tile set, you shouldn't be aiming to make it look like your mountains are a bunch of rocks that are all cemented together. Instead, it should be a consolidated surface that possibly has some rocks in/on it, or it's a roughly textured rocky surface where parts of the mountains have eroded away. In pictorial terms, http://199.101.98.242/media/shots/43520-Tomato_Adventure_%28J%29%28Cezar%29-2.jpg - don't make your mountains look like this because that's a pile of rocks, instead aim for something that feels consolidated and structured, like the larger image StoneStephenT posted, or http://www.cubed3.com/staff/jesusraz/som08.jpg - this . When in doubt, look up reference and simplify/tile-ify what you learn from it. I realise that's not directly helpful to make your existing tiles look good, but I hope it'll give you something to think about, and a direction to go in. It's much easier to make things when you have a clear visual of what you want. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 10 November 2014 at 10:36pm
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The Floating Island concept might have complicated things for me as I had enitouly intended to Islands to have similar terrain as the mountains.
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Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 11 November 2014 at 8:00am
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Giving them similar terrain is just as telling (to the player/viewer) as different terrain, since it implies the islands were created in a similar way, at around the same time - a natural part of this world's magic-fueled geology. It also makes your job easier, since you'll be able to use the same tiles for the mountains and the islands. And, the references I linked (and similar refs you find) will work for the islands too in that case! |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 11 November 2014 at 8:59am
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Okay then its settled, the floating islands are just there for a bit of platforming as for the ground I think it would probably be easier for me to start a fresh do you have any tips on starting things up? As for the colors I've decided to use 4 colors on the ground instead of 3. |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 11 November 2014 at 9:47am
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I recommend starting by figuring out how the ground looks, and worry about tiling and the colours later. It's easy to reduce the colour count later. You could even start working in greyscale and colorise later. If your tiles work in greyscale, they'll work in colour, but when you're working in colour, it can be easy to not notice that your tiles lack contrast or form. If you have time, get a pencil and do some studies from photo reference of different ways cliffs and such look, so that you can get a feel for the kinds of shapes and values you find in that sort of thing. |
Posted By: PixelSnader
Date Posted: 11 November 2014 at 5:53pm
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Actually I think those two examples look rather flat. Yes, the tiles individually have depth, but because they ALL do, it feels more like a bas-relief than actual depth and separated form.
Compare those to these images: http://www.pixeljoint.com/pixelart/69875.htm"> 
http://www.pixeljoint.com/pixelart/31589.htm">  http://www.pixeljoint.com/pixelart/16452.htm">
They (and the linked frogatto image) prioritize form over detail, which makes them a lot more readable as a whole image. It's a very common problem for pixel artists, they put the cart (detail) before the horse (form). It's logical when you consider that pixel art revolves around pixel-level control, so very small scale. Makes you forget about the large scale really easily. But you shouldn't, because that large scale is actually much more important. You can make a decently playable game without details (cough http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDaa3Cq6c7M - thomaswasalone cough) but you can't make a game that plays well if players cant discern what is what. So for that reason I suggest creating a mockup first. Paint in the background, paint in the floating islands, then paint in the foreground with the platforms and interactable objects, and only then start adding in details. And then based on that whole image, you can start figuring out how to turn it in to tiles. Remember, an architect doesn't design a house by sketching the doorhandles first. ------------- ▄▄█ ▄▄█ ▄█▄ ▄█▄ |
Posted By: heyguy
Date Posted: 12 November 2014 at 12:52am
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Check this tutorial out. It looks like it might be right up your alley! http://www.wildbunny.co.uk/blog/2012/03/01/designing-a-retro-pixel-art-tile-set/ Right now I think it rock looks too much like dirt. You could change the color to a blue, gray, purple, etc but I think you need to do some repixeling.    Also, why don't you create some darker lower tiles similar to the tiles in that third image posted by PixelSnader? |
Posted By: Limes
Date Posted: 12 November 2014 at 9:30am
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I don't see much difference in your drawing from...
I would scrap what you have and start from fresh colors, Just go for a very rocky feeling and try to avoid that orangy color. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 12 November 2014 at 11:28am
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Yes that's what I was gonna do and I'm aiming to make to ground more like in the "Sword of Mana". hehe some things about that game I just don't understand, but the pixel art in that game is awesome! oh and eishiya thanks for the warning I was considering making my rock just like that  ! |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 17 November 2014 at 1:19am
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I've decided to go monochrome, but that's not so easy as it may sacrifice important details in the grass, I
need more than the 4 shades of the game boy, I heard that the Wonderswan could display 8 shades of grey but I can't find anything, can someone give a hand please? |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 17 November 2014 at 5:17am
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Since you're relatively new, I think you should just worry about getting things to look how you want instead of conforming to existing hardware. Work on getting good, then you can work on working with stricter limitations when you don't have to worry about more basic concepts anymore. I've found a couple of sources that also say the WonderSwan had 8 greys, but you're not likely to find a palette for it since it's just greys (likely equally spaced), and since modern palettes for old devices aren't actually accurate, since even if their colour values are identical, they were seen in a different context and thus perceived differently from how we'd see them. For example, the Gameboy's "greys" were really green on the screen (and the shades varied depending on the light, since it was not backlit), and has empty space around each pixel. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 18 November 2014 at 4:53am
Thanks Eishiya, I think I've nailed the grass but the ground doesn't look right its not done yet either but...
|
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 19 November 2014 at 12:31am
Wait here I've got rock now! but its still not quite right, but what do you think? thoughts? |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 19 November 2014 at 5:53am
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Grass: It looks pillow-shaded xP It's not bad to have an outline on the grass, but in general it'll look more natural to had it lighter on top, darker closer to the ground. Rocks: A vast improvement over your earlier ones, but it reads largely as a pile of rocks (or scales, even) rather than something structured. Have you looked at reference? Are you going for any specific look or structure, or just trying things until something looks good? |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 20 November 2014 at 12:22am
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Well I actually wanted to do something similar to the Sword of Mana but it just turned into a pile of rocks, and when I tryed again it still turned into a pile of rocks... |
Posted By: MrHai
Date Posted: 20 November 2014 at 4:55am
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Make no mistake, your latest effort is a huge improvement. It seems you have grasped some key concepts about pixeling rock/ground. Don't be discouraged if your next try still isn't what you want it to be. For every iteration you learn something. I think your progress so far is quite impressive, keep going! ------------- "Work is more fun than fun" -John Cale |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 20 November 2014 at 6:35am
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The Sword of Mana cliffs are largely nonsense (but those same tiles recoloured as cave walls work well), but they feel very structured and they're pretty. I think you chose a great source of inspiration. Definitely do study the SoM tiles. The way they and most other artists achieve structure is by not using their full range of values on every single detail. Instead, they use the full range to define the general form (such as the pillars of stone in SoM), and details (such as individual rocks) are created with minor variation in value. I recommend giving http://androidarts.com/art_tut.htm - the PSG Art Tutorial a read. The relevant part to what you're doing here is the second half of the "Focus points" section (with the important forms/texture/both links, and the scribbly chart), but I recommend giving the whole thing a read when you have time. There's a wealth of knowledge on that page, and a lot of it is relevant to pixel art too. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 20 November 2014 at 10:40am
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So the Sword of Mana rock tiles are actually recolored cave tiles? well I never. And thanks for the tutorial I'll definitely give it a good look some time. |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 20 November 2014 at 10:44am
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Originally posted by Turon So the Sword of Mana rock tiles are actually recolored cave tiles? well I never. More likely, they were designed from the beginning to work as both, they just ended up being more appropriate to caves. The end result reads well enough and looks attractive, which is the main thing. Sword of Mana has a lot of reused/recoloured tiles, they're just so well-made and placed so well that you don't really notice while playing. |
Posted By: PixelSnader
Date Posted: 20 November 2014 at 11:29am
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Originally posted by eishiya
the Gameboy's "greys" were really green on the screen (and the shades varied depending on the light, since it was not backlit), and has empty space around each pixel. Technically, every screen has space around the pixels. But it was more noticeable on the GB because it wasn't backlit. Our current screens are simple, flat black when they're off. We light up pixels to create the image (instead of darkening them), and the light tends to bloom/glow a bit, which makes the pixels 'spill over' into the gutters. In fact, a https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/448525/Creative/photography/SubpixelHD_002/hd.jpg - modern backlit pixel often has more empty space around it (relatively, that is) compared to a https://dlnmh9ip6v2uc.cloudfront.net/assets/4/a/2/8/1/52571475757b7f9b798b4567.png - monochrome unlit pixel . This image illustrates the effect a bit: 
The lone white pixel should stand out much more than the black one does. Aaaaaanyway. Yes those last tiles are a good bunch better. The tiles themselves have a much better sense of shape, material and lighting. The grass still feels too hard and blocky though. And to be frank, you're still going to run into the problem I described earlier; strong local depth will lead to weak overall feeling of depth. This image from the tutorial eishiya linked shows it well: 
Is there any particular you're switching to a monochrome palette? If it's because you think it's simpler than using colors, well you might be half correct. You won't have to worry as much about selecting a nice palette, but it'll be harder to accurately portray a material, and you need to think better about your color choices to get a good visual disctinction between objects. Now, I'm not saying you shouldn't go monochrome. In fact, it'd be great practice. You limit the amount of tools you use (from hue/sat/lum to just luminance) and you're forced to think about some focused issues instead of many different ones. This means you'd learn much more about shape/form and prioritization than you would with colors in your palette. I'm just saying you need to be aware of the impact of going monochrome. ------------- ▄▄█ ▄▄█ ▄█▄ ▄█▄ |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 22 November 2014 at 4:31am
| So how can I improve on the Grass? |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 22 November 2014 at 6:48am
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I don't think there's a rule against it or anything, but it seems a bit rude to me to remake the same post just to bump up your thread, just to make it look like you're not double-posting. Between what has been told to you, the various tutorials linked in this thread, and your own observations of real grass, you should already have everything you need to make great-looking grass. Experiment! Try different things, different ways of applying what you've learned from this thread. It sounds like you're expecting people to tell you exactly how to proceed. That's not how art works. We're not here to do your work for you, we're here to help you learn. You'll never get good if you don't take the time to think critically and experiment on your own. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 22 November 2014 at 9:53am
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Well sorry then I probably should have been more patient...Anyways I just redid the rock to look more like a cliff, not final product but I think I'm closer. I didn't do anything to the grass yet. 
Sorry that lone rock was just for reference I was going to remove it but didn't get round. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 24 November 2014 at 3:45am
Well then... what do you all make of this! I'm sure this is at least close to being some sort of cliff wouldn't you say? |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 24 November 2014 at 5:40am
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I think you're definitely getting there! I think you're overusing the darkest grey though, making everything look very separate. You should use it very sparingly. Perhaps use that 2nd darkest grey for most of the smaller/shallower shaded areas instead? That way, the darkest shadows can really feel dark and deep. You're giving almost every single chunk of rock the full range of values, which flattens everything. Have some more rocks (not just right under the grass, but in various spots) where they only use a subset of the values, which will make those rocks feel flatter, and the entire surface will feel less uniform. You're also shading every rock as a sort of jagged jellybean, they all have exactly one bright protrusion at the top, no other highlighted bits elsewhere. That could be fine depending on what rocks you're drawing, but if that's not an effect you're consciously going for, try giving some rocks multiply protruding/highlighted bits and see how it looks. It might end up looking worse, but it's good to experiment. Your edge tiles create a silhouette for the cliff that appears to have nothing to do with the rocks you've drawn. I think working on those instead of just leaving the old silhouette in should help you get a feel for the 3D form of the rocks better, so you know how/where to shade since you'll see them from an extra angle (the side) at the edges. |
Posted By: PixelSnader
Date Posted: 24 November 2014 at 3:27pm
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You're still using the same value range for both materials, and you're still not putting the tileset in context. ------------- ▄▄█ ▄▄█ ▄█▄ ▄█▄ |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 24 November 2014 at 10:00pm
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What does putting the tiles in context mean?
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Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 25 November 2014 at 5:09am
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It means using them in an environment/map, seeing how they work with other visuals (other tiles, characters, etc). The easiest way to put your tiles in context is to make a mock-up of your game using
them, and fill in any missing parts with suitable colours or rough
drawings of what you plan to make. Doing so helps see whether your tiles work well together early on. Working on anything in a vacuum (without context) usually leads to spending too much time on it, and then having to redo it anyway because it doesn't fit xP |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 25 November 2014 at 11:25am
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the most immediate acid to develop would probably be the background, but backgrounds are so large its a nightmare trying to do it in pixel-art... is there some sort of way? and I have been trying to minimize the really dark color.  |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 25 November 2014 at 11:37am
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For the sake of context, the backgrounds, other tiles, etc don't have to be refined pixel art, they can just be rough sketches that give you an overall idea of how they'll look. Otherwise, it's be pretty pointless - you'd have to finish each section before putting it all together, which is the exact opposite of the goal here xP As for backgrounds in pixel art in general, since eventually you'll probably need to do them - it's not as hard as you might think. Being backgrounds, they shouldn't be as detailed as the foreground, so you'll actually be using a lot of solid areas of colour. You'll also probably be working with fewer colours for the backgrounds, since backgrounds need to have less contrast to avoid clashing with the foreground. As for your updated tiles: I'm honestly not sure what to suggest anymore. There are a lot of different ways to go from here, depending on the look you want. The only real suggestion I have is to consider if the highlights need to be so rough or if they can be rounded. Depending on the kind of rock you're trying to depict, rough ones might be suitable, or they might not. Perhaps you should try adding some colours, and refine the details once you have everything coloured and tiled. I recommend starting from scratch on the colours instead of using the old ones you had. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 26 November 2014 at 3:22am
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so you say maybe I should add color and see how it looks? I'll have a go and see. but... have you ever made a tileset of rocks? whats been your experience? |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 26 November 2014 at 7:35am
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I have, and in all cases I had a pretty good idea of what I wanted to end up with, so it was largely a matter of just getting the pixels down. Remember: You're the only one who knows what you want these tiles to feel like when they're done. Any feedback you get here is based on our (most likely highly inaccurate) ideas of what you're aiming for, so make sure you don't follow it blindly. For example, having a sense of large form to the rocks combined with some smaller details is a good idea in general, but in some games, it might not be desirable, you might want it to be flat. I think your apparent lack of a clear visual goal and the fact that you're working from details outward (starting with rock tiles rather than a sketched out level/map) are what's causing you to have so much trouble. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 27 November 2014 at 12:49pm
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Did you say something about sketching to get a better picture on what I should do? did you mean sketch on paper? well sketching isn't one of my strengths but what do you make of this? again cause it isn't pixel art I have just provided a http://links1373.photobucket.com/user/Turokei/media/MyVisionforSkyLand_zpsad9d2fff.jpg.html - link . |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 27 November 2014 at 3:31pm
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Sketch in whatever medium you like. Or, block the entire stage out (e.g. make solid squares for solid tiles, other kinds of squares for other features of the stage, etc) and then draw the tiles on top of that. The way I usually do it is I block out a level that would use those tiles, then sketch features over it (cliffs, houses, trees, etc, all to scale but very roughly drawn) then do my pixel work on a layer above that. Since sketching isn't one of your strengths, I recommend working on it. You don't need to have great pencil control, but the general art skills that go into making a good drawing or painting are helpful for pixel art. The art tutorial I linked earlier covers most of those skills, but it's up to you to practice them and put them to use. (Unfortunately I can't give you feedback on your sketch because Photobucket hates me. If you can use it to direct your pixelling, then it's fine.) |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 28 November 2014 at 2:00am
| Well thanks for all the help so far (not being sarcastic)! I'll see what I can do now... |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 30 November 2014 at 6:23am
Well I made another sketch I think may be better. It isn't pixel art so if you guy don't want it here I can remove if necessary but here it is. |
Posted By: DrTripwire
Date Posted: 30 November 2014 at 1:39pm
| Shows a lot of promise! I think it would look epic in pixels. |
Posted By: Limes
Date Posted: 30 November 2014 at 9:01pm
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Your sketch doesn't seem to show a lot of texture, or contrast in just about anything everything is just grey there is no black or white.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smAJFoedfvE - Hopefully this helps you One of the important skills he displays is proper https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=117AN3MQuVs - crosshatching d] |
Posted By: Limes
Date Posted: 01 December 2014 at 9:47am
| I do like how the foreground is easily visible from background. |
Posted By: PixelSnader
Date Posted: 01 December 2014 at 11:59am
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Have you tried sketching on a PC? Like, in photoshop or MSPaint but crudely, and not like pixel art. I ask because on a PC it's much easier to edit composition and balance. Think of the time it takes to shade the entire sky with a pencil, for example. On a PC you could just use paintbucket/floodfill. ------------- ▄▄█ ▄▄█ ▄█▄ ▄█▄ |
Posted By: Limes
Date Posted: 01 December 2014 at 12:23pm
| I prefer sketching to photoshop sketching, unless I have a pad that shows the screen directly on it. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 03 December 2014 at 5:28am
Well I've recolored and altered a bit, which one do you like more?  The grass may not look great but I'm keeping it for context, I plan on altering later. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 07 December 2014 at 4:53am
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I have played around with the fist coloration And I think it looks much more like a cliff now. |
Posted By: RebeaLeion
Date Posted: 07 December 2014 at 5:12am
| it's more readable, that's for sure. the second of two is the better. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 07 December 2014 at 7:50am
| The second coloration? |
Posted By: Limes
Date Posted: 08 December 2014 at 7:36am
Practice drawing rocks just like this then try to incorporate them into the design. At the moment the dirt looks really messy and all over the place try to simpilize it just PRACTISE ROCKS |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 09 December 2014 at 9:35am
| um so another redo? okay... rocks, rocks are easy... |
Posted By: Limes
Date Posted: 09 December 2014 at 12:54pm
| yeah just draw rocks individually so they make sense when putting them into the big picture. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 10 December 2014 at 1:06am
| I have to be careful so as not to make It look like a pile of rocks... |
Posted By: skittle
Date Posted: 10 December 2014 at 2:38am
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Seconding what Limes said. Imo, you're more likely to get better results if you try drawing each individual rock into a tile instead of doing them all in one go. Then it gives you a better idea of how all the rocks effect each other in terms of lighting. You don't need to do it that way, but you may get better results.
If you want your tiles to really pop, try to emphasize on your darker colours instead of making your dominant colour the lightest in your palette. Think about it in terms of edges. You have a rock that has a certain amount of sides, which side will be darkest and which side will be the lighest? As oppose to making small cracks to separate each rock from each other. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 16 December 2014 at 6:26am
What do you think of these rocks they only use 4 colors and I think these are the best yet.
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Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 16 December 2014 at 7:47am
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They look more like tufts of fur to me. They could work if you're going for a http://www.utgrotto.org/images/2006_may_27_049_flowstone.jpg - flowstone look, but then those colours are not appropriate. I was under the impression you were going for more of a boulder look, anyway? I have no idea though, you still haven't actually said what you're trying to depict. |
Posted By: Limes
Date Posted: 16 December 2014 at 9:50am
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Your rocks come off as goop. THEY ARE ALSO PILLOW SHADED!!!!!
Okay step 1 decide on a light source and draw a random bulge of the darkest shade. Try to use lots of angles to make it look rocky. Do not make it go all flowy like the goop, and stick to solid square like clusters. Step two: highlight with second darkest color ONLY on the lighted side of the rock remember to use square like clusters. Then 3rd darkest color to bring more pop and finally your highlight to finalize the image. Don't overuse the highlight. 
The dominant shade should be the darkest. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 16 December 2014 at 10:47am
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I would like to stress that my ultimate objective is to make a good cliff and grass tileset. so basically I should make the shape of the rock as the darkest color and add lighter shades to it and take note of the lightsource and I'm good to go? |
Posted By: Limes
Date Posted: 16 December 2014 at 11:58am
| Ultimately that is what you want to do. your rocks don't really follow any light source. Making the rocks pop should be the main focus. the way you had them they looked flat. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 17 December 2014 at 4:51am
How do these rocks look? |
Posted By: Limes
Date Posted: 17 December 2014 at 7:15am
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Much better :D
But you still seem to be dragging some lines down, not sure why you are doing that. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 17 December 2014 at 10:14am
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is it bad to drag lines down? |
Posted By: Limes
Date Posted: 17 December 2014 at 10:16am
| In some cases no. It usually isn't with rocks. if you look at some of fools works you will rarely see him do it. If not at all. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 18 December 2014 at 5:04am
| what are "some of fools works"? your not being very clear, unless I'm mistaken... |
Posted By: Limes
Date Posted: 18 December 2014 at 7:33am
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Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 19 December 2014 at 9:57am
um... forgive me if I appear ignorant but what er... point were you um... trying to make with those awesome pieces of pixel art? 
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Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 19 December 2014 at 10:02am
| Those are examples of Fool's pixel art, since you asked what "some of Fool's works" was referring to. |
Posted By: Limes
Date Posted: 19 December 2014 at 10:17am
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Ohh I kindove just assumed you knew who fool was. These are examples of fools rocks.
Fool is the most... "decorated" pixel artist. ------------- |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 19 December 2014 at 11:16am
| why that looked awesome! why would that be something a fool made? does my latest rocks look fool? |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 19 December 2014 at 12:18pm
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Originally posted by Turon why that looked awesome! why would that be something a fool made? does my latest rocks look fool? "Fool" is the artist's username. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 19 December 2014 at 12:31pm
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oh... okay I get it now, "Fool" is a genius! anyways must I remove those "lines coming down" or not? |
Posted By: eishiya
Date Posted: 19 December 2014 at 12:39pm
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That's your decision to make, not anyone else's. Consider why those lines are there. If there's a good, useful reason, then keep them. If there's not, then get rid of them. They make your rocks look indistinct and drippy. If that's your intention, that's great. If it's not, then you should consider making changes. |
Posted By: Turon
Date Posted: 21 December 2014 at 5:22am
I am trying to minimize on the drippyness but I'd also like to know which one of these colorations you prefer?  |