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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 18 May 2016 at 5:49am |
As the title might imply, I've been working on a game for the last while or so, and I'm getting to the point where I've got to start taking the art assets half seriously.
So far I feel as if I'm doing a few things wrong, but I have no idea what they are and why, so criticism/pointers would be greatly appreciated. Right now all I have to show for it is a lousy idle sprite and a mockup for a stage background/theme. Idle sprite: ![]() Stage mockup: ![]() Not overly keen on the clouds and skyline myself. Can't quite put my finger on it as to why. |
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dpixel
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 February 2015 Online Status: Offline Posts: 564 |
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Your water looks fantastic.
The rock tiles look a bit busy and the shading I would think would look more like this: ![]() |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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That... Does look better actually. Not to mention some simplification to that particular tile would save a lot of time when it comes to making all the variations. I'll have a play around with that.
What about the rocks in the background though? |
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dpixel
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 February 2015 Online Status: Offline Posts: 564 |
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Originally posted by PrototypeTheta What about the rocks in the background though? Yeah. Same deal. Your light is coming from the rear. |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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One quick conversion later.
![]() Yeah, ok, this makes a hell of a difference. EDIT: Changed the shading on the background rocks, and copied and flipped the YOLT volcano hanger thing to the other side to see how it looks. Might have to make up something else to replace the one on the right. |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Throw a few variations of the rock tile into the mix and replaced the second volcano with something else
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CuriousBeefJerky
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 23 April 2015 Online Status: Offline Posts: 132 |
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Your clouds look too solid in my opinion. Not really sure how you'd make it look less solid though.. Might have some lines coming off the clouds making it look more "wispy."
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Not sure about making it wispy, but I can try stretching them out and shade them differently might lessen the effect, or at least provide a better alternative to before.
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eishiya
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 04 August 2022 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1109 |
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I think the issue with the clouds is they appear lit from front-above even though the sun is behind and below them. They're also entirely unaffected by the sunset/sunrise colouring of the rest of the sky.
That super-dark bit in front of the sun looks too dark. The sun, even at sunset/sunrise is very bright, so its light should "spill" into the forms of things in front of it, making them lighter everywhere where they overlap the sun (which is the entirety of that thing). Example. If there is parallax going on and you can't do that, then an easy semi-solution is to have atmospheric perspective, that is, to make the far-away parts be less contrasted and closer in hue to the sky-colour near the horizon. |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Changed the lighting/colours on the clouds, probably still needs work.
Brightened up the central oil rig as well. ![]() |
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buffoftheclown
Midshipman ![]() Joined: 19 May 2016 Online Status: Offline Posts: 40 |
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Can you have the water from the drain continue over the rock bellow it and keep flowing down? Looks like slime instead of water? If it is supposed to be slime, my apologies.
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NancyGold
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 27 October 2021 Online Status: Offline Posts: 526 |
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The character is so gray and boring that even Awesome Possum will kick his sad ass. I love the sea thought, but the Sun's reflection on the water should be bigger and different. Look up references.
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Originally posted by snv
The character is so gray and boring that even Awesome Possum will kick his sad ass. I love the sea thought, but the Sun's reflection on the water should be bigger and different. Look up references. One quick punt later: ![]() Feels more accurate, probably should have looked up visual references in the first place but hey ho. As for the character, I'm pretty stuck as to what to do with it to be honest. It's probably the oldest part of the project so I've grandfathered it more than I should have. |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Made some changes to the character sprite, though I'm not sure if this is doing anything or I'm just polishing a turd at this point.
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NancyGold
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 27 October 2021 Online Status: Offline Posts: 526 |
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It is good enough for a free flash game. I've seen worse in steam games. Yet people can still read it as "this a megaman clone, but more boring".
Anyway, designing a great character is a black magic and there are numerous articles on it. You have to pick target auditory. People generally like chars like Crash Bandicoot, Shantae and Earthworm Jim; but then again, these games had great gameplay, and could had made even boring characters seemingly great. Some people would find Mario annoying. TLDR: it is all subjective ![]() Originally posted by PrototypeTheta
Made some changes to the character sprite, though I'm not sure if this is doing anything or I'm just polishing a turd at this point. ![]() |
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DieMango
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 23 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 180 |
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The ,,Buildings'' look kinda wierd this kinda setting because they seem to have no shadows...
The charcter isnt super bad...just very plain ATM...maybe add shulder armor and tweak head and chest a little? ATM this is a Can-robot wich means he is built out of cylinders and there are just stripes to make him fancy (and that just works by cars) |
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matt0
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 05 July 2025 Online Status: Offline Posts: 54 |
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I'm enjoying watching this take shape!
One thing I'd suggest would be to tidy up the bands of colour in the sky - try making them symmetrical on either side of the sun. |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Originally posted by DieMango
there are just stripes to make him fancy (and that just works by cars) But stripes make everything faster! In all seriousness though, I think I'm going to have to leave this part alone until I'm out of exams and have the time to really sit down and go through it properly. Every change I've made so far has been in 5-10 minute breaks between work. As for the buildings, do you mean they aren't casting a shadow or that there is no shadow on the building itself? If the latter I have been trying to address that: ![]() Pretty happy with the oil rig on the left. Not so much with the box on the right (could probably turn it into a cylinder and call it a storage tank, then I could probably find a reason to blow it up from within the level). Originally posted by matt0
I'm enjoying watching this take shape! One thing I'd suggest would be to tidy up the bands of colour in the sky - try making them symmetrical on either side of the sun. With regards to the asymmetry, there is some method to my madness. The idea was to plonk a big landmass over on the left hand side, which would create such a distortion (perhaps not this dramatic though). That said, I've been a right muppet and stuck the landmass over on the left hand side, completely negating the entire point. I think I'd like to re-draw it completely, try and add in some sea fog or pollution around the oil rigs. |
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dpixel
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 February 2015 Online Status: Offline Posts: 564 |
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How about a bugman? I was messing around how to shade this from the rear and went overboard. Maybe it can give you some ideas.
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DieMango
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 23 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 180 |
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Da left one looks better now indeed...but i think i know whats bothering me:
They have that very weird outline. The Entire thing just looks out of place because the antenne looks normal but the building has that wierd outline (sorry when i cant state my point...me bad english do) |
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NancyGold
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 27 October 2021 Online Status: Offline Posts: 526 |
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Originally posted by DieMango
Da left one looks better now indeed...but i think i know whats bothering me: They have that very weird outline. The Entire thing just looks out of place because the antenne looks normal but the building has that wierd outline (sorry when i cant state my point...me bad english do) The background/parallax items should have less contrast to avoid distracting player into thinking that they are interactive. There are also atmospheric fog effects. desaturating far objects. |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Originally posted by dpixel
How about a bugman? I was messing around how to shade this from the rear and went overboard. Maybe it can give you some ideas. ![]() No thanks, I've got enough of those in the programming. Jokes aside I've always been pretty dead set on using a mechanical protagonist (it's a little easier to justify why your character is spamming missiles Macross style out of it's backside when it's a machine, at least without playing the rule of cool that is). But that said, I am in need of a decent range of weird and wonderful aliens to fill the world with, and a bugger-like (or formic-like if you've only seen the film) race are definitely on the to-do list. Originally posted by DieMango
They have that very weird outline. The Entire thing just looks out of place because the antenne looks normal but the building has that wierd outline (sorry when i cant state my point...me bad english do) I think I understand what you're getting at, the shading should continue all the way around and not be suddenly cut off by said outline. At least that's the theory with the cylinder, with the box it could be interpreted as part of the structure, but I'm not keeping it that shape so that's irrelevant here anyway. I've had a go at removing this outline (left structure only, still haven't decided what's going to happen to the right) and had a somewhat hamfisted go at reducing the contrast of the background objects. ![]() |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Decided to get some practise drawing humanoids. Ended up with this rather basic enemy soldier.
![]() Not keen on the right (or rear) leg. Or the gun. |
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NancyGold
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 27 October 2021 Online Status: Offline Posts: 526 |
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Originally posted by PrototypeTheta
Decided to get some practise drawing humanoids. Ended up with this rather basic enemy soldier. ![]() Not keen on the right (or rear) leg. Or the gun. Make a half-naked female cyborg with large boobs and ass, maybe with a few megaman/samus references. Instant selling point for your game. ![]() |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Having another crack at this, keeping a few pointers from dPixel's interpretation in mind here.
![]() Certainly feels better as a whole, though the pauldrons don't feel right to me, and while I'd like the legs longer, I don't have much problem sticking with this. |
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Damian
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 February 2023 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 455 |
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Hey man, made a quick edit.
I probably should of paid more attention to your profile picture though, but it will still hopefully be useful to you. A few things to think about maybe. What materials are you using? Smooth Metals tend to have a high contrast between its brightest and darkest colours, but the red paint or any decals while also a smooth shiny surface might have slightly less contrast. Thats a simple example in relation to what you've made, but thinking about these materials can go a long way in helping to render properly. Google images is your friend, go look for a reference when in doubt. Think more about light. Light theory is tough to get your head around, I struggle with it a lot myself. And here I notice about 3 different light sources, which can be visually confusing. Setting a single light source and adhering to it will go a long way in making all your characters look consistent. I made a start to this as you can see, with a light source above and slightly to the right. Shadows are important to, like under the chin, armpits etc There are other things I touched on in the edit, such as a more natural pose/stance, making sense of how different parts of the body attach to each other in a way that makes sense. But I have mentioned them, so might be worth taking some time to think about it. Hope all my rambling makes some sense. ![]() |
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NancyGold
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 27 October 2021 Online Status: Offline Posts: 526 |
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Originally posted by Damian
Metals tend to have a high contrast The problem we don't know what material the robot is made of. Real world autonomous robots usually made of some lightweight yet strong material, like polycarbonates. Heavy robot movement will also quickly deplete the energy source. Although energy shortage could be a justification for some unusual gameplay mechanics, like where player has to continuously hunt for energy cells instead of mario coins, and taking damage just removes large chunks for energy due to energy shield. |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Originally posted by snv
Originally posted by Damian
Metals tend to have a high contrast The problem we don't know what material the robot is made of. Real world autonomous robots usually made of some lightweight yet strong material, like polycarbonates. Heavy robot movement will also quickly deplete the energy source. Although energy shortage could be a justification for some unusual gameplay mechanics, like where player has to continuously hunt for energy cells instead of mario coins, and taking damage just removes large chunks for energy due to energy shield. I had envisioned it as being a lightweight ceramic armour (slight oxymoron there, but this is set in the far future so there's some leeway), with the dark black sections being some kind of flexible rubber. The problem with this is it's probably going to be painted over anyway. My immediate thoughts are to use something like this as reference: http://photos.jibble.org/Vehicles/Tanks/Bovington%20Tank%20Museum/Polish%20built%20T-55%20with%20Iraqi%20armour%20modifications%20IMG_2772.JPG As for energy, I had planned for an energy shield to be a sort of power up, so that idea could work for that, though I don't think tying it to the player's health is a good idea for what I want to do. |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Well. This isn't dead, just been busy re-writing the thing.
Well first off I've managed a few basic animations, an idle which I still thoroughly dislike and a basic shooting animation. ![]() I understand the gif isn't great quality and is a bit slow so these might be more useful Gyazo mp4 Some footage from the prototype, just some stuff thrown together so I could figure out the basic gameplay I've also been trying to re-do the sky from the background I've already shown, done some experiments with dithering but I'm honestly not sure how I feel about it. ![]() And finally I've started thinking about another level, set in a forest by the coast. Trying to figure out how to tree, so I've taken a shot at the bark. ![]() |
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RebeaLeion
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 04 October 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 321 |
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tree is nice.
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Not dead.
Started working on this again about a week ago. Gone and started work on a new background, which may or may not be useful anywhere. ![]() Also refined the character sprite a little more ![]() And started taking animations seriously. Nearly finished a run cycle (just needs hands). ![]() |
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Hapiel
Rear Admiral ![]() ![]() Joined: 30 June 2023 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3266 |
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You could improve the run cycle by having a mid air position. Now it looks like he is walking really fast, because his legs remain in contact with the floor
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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There actually is a mid air position, but I can probably do something to exaggerate it a bit more.
(might be worth noting that the gif is running almost twice as fast as it should, you can see the correct timing here) |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Lost the original file I had for my background, having to re-draw most of it so I can parallax it properly.
![]() Certainly feels better than last time but I still can't get the sky right. |
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DieMango
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 23 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 180 |
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First of all: Nice sprite bro :D
Second...clouds shoudt be giant cotten pillows of softness... try to make long and thin clouds and try to make very clear line where the gradiants of the sky end (if you dont know what i mean...then ask if i have a example file) the most jarring thing tho is the composition of this scene in general... never put the big thing in the middle and have it as straight as it is right now...dont make to many islands...its a background after all and shoudt distract the viewer. I am very tired so my english is probabaly terrible atm |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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The idea is that all the islands are parallaxed and constantly move as you progress through the level so the composition will always be changing. That said I can try and target certain layouts when I get around to putting this up in engine.
As for the sky and whatnot, this is a terribly hacky edit but is this roughly what you mean? ![]() |
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DieMango
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 23 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 180 |
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Yeah...look at some refrences for the right amount of fluff...in the clouds
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Made a few more tweaks to the background and gotten it working inside the engine.
![]() https://gyazo.com/8522e99b220a9210e8a99e40470e140f Also gone and started work on a death animation ![]() https://gyazo.com/8eb40f9cc55e82f8e0d1659eb8a07afc |
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DieMango
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 23 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 180 |
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You dont need so many frames for the legs blowing of...just 2 frames for a fast animation is enough.
Nice...the background looks prrrrrrrrrrrretty good. |
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Poltergeist
Seaman ![]() Joined: 08 May 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3 |
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I love the death animation
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Started working on attack animations
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t3nshi
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 07 May 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 29 |
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Uh, nice work! I can see the Zero inspiration in there.
I'm worried about the sword effect reach, it looks a bit too narrow. Also it is too outlined and looks solid. You might want to make it without outlines altoghether. |
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XLEdwards91
Seaman ![]() Joined: 15 May 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 6 |
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Honestly, the most recent updates look a lot better from the past ones. Hard for me to explain, maybe because it seems and looks more...simpler? As well as the shading doesn't look overly complicated. Not sure if that made any sense to you, since I'm still learning myself, but I know shading is a pretty big thing in pixel art, in making your characters or environment 'pop'.
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Improved the shoot animation following some feedback given to me elsewhere.
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Whacked out a few basic character portraits for dialog and whatnot.
![]() Decided that the jaw part would serve as a detachable comm unit or something. |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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![]() Attempting to put some form of expression on the gormless bastard. |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Working on another level theme
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Quake
Commander ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 September 2008 Online Status: Offline Posts: 190 |
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Very nice! Really good progress
I'd personally make the grass simpler. For example: ![]() |
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PrototypeTheta
Midshipman ![]() ![]() Joined: 03 November 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 39 |
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Totally original space station.
![]() Probably still needs some cleanup. |
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Permafrost_
Seaman ![]() Joined: 09 May 2017 Online Status: Offline Posts: 7 |
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I'm the 3000th (and 3001st) view on this forum. Nice job with the space station. The lighting makes it really stand out like a 3D object.
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